[Men Open] 2005 Provincial Draw

[Aves]

Originally Posted by knvb

I've heard this a couple of times now ... is it really true the FVSL actually makes late season yellows card suspensions sit the BC's and not next season? If it's true, way to lend a hand to the teams representing your 'league'.

Is this not the case in vmsl?
If not, then its not a bc soccer requirement then?
Who knows about this stuff?...please pm me or post the relevant info here.
Sounds like an appeal may be in order.
Not that I care.

[knowone]

SENSEI, that was really gai (mispelled as not to offend gays)

[Skip]

Aves,

Yes, it appears the VMSL is not making players in your situation sit out their game until next season.

I've already sent some 'correspondence' to the appropriate league official, and am awaiting a reply. You just don't worry your pretty little (....and bald) head. I'm sure you have some ass to wipe, or shoes to tie.....so get on it.

~S

[Skip]

Have received a reply from the FVSL discipline head. He assures us that all three leagues are on the same page with regards to the issue of cards and suspensions.

If this is the case, I assume that the VMSL will be getting a friendly reminded from BCSA.

[Aves]

Originally Posted by Skip

Have received a reply from the FVSL discipline head. He assures us that all three leagues are on the same page with regards to the issue of cards and suspensions.

If this is the case, I assume that the VMSL will be getting a friendly reminded from BCSA.

ouch.

I'd be interested in checking out page 43 of the bcsa discipline guidelines (have been told that this spells it out.)
Anyone have access to this source?

I checked out the rules page on the senior competitions web page and it stresses that red cards carry over but only mentions yellows in regards to how they accumulate during the cup tournament.click on sr comp rules Another sidebar is that the yellows one might receive in provincial cup play do not carry over to league competition so should yellows play a role in the reverse? I know they(league cards) get wiped out upon entry but if a player gets his second yellow(not in the same game) in the provincial cup final does he have to sit out his first league game the next season?...and does this get tracked/ happen? If not, why should it apply the other way around?

If there is an accepted belief/practice that any red warrants at least one game suspension, anywhere, anytime, because that card is based on one incident (or one game in the case of two yellows in one game), does this same perspective/intent apply to yellow cards when the previous yellow quite possibly (and did) happen 10 games earlier?

I found it interesting that a number of people in the know thought otherwise or didn't know . Surely this must have come up before.

not bitter, just asking the questions about the consistency of this policy as players move between league and provincial cup competitions, and back.

I was in pre-law you know

[vicman]

Accumulation of yellow cards resulting in a suspension, carryover into BC Cup play.
It was confirmed by our VISL board last week via the BCSA.

[J_B]

If this rain keeps up some of the games might have to be moved to turf. What turf would they choose? Here is hoping the league have thought of this already.

Cheers
JB

[cainy]

So it's a done deal we will be missing Aves for the first game. What i don't understand is this. We play 18 league games, Aves has 2 yellow cards. Now upon entering the provincial cup, he would be clear to play, and the slate wiped clean. Shouldn't the same rules apply to our cup ( pak) like the islands Jackson cup or VMSLs Imperial cup. I would think, if you enter your own cup competition clear to play, then like the B.C cup you should start fresh. Unfortunately this isn't the case, Aves picks up his 3rd yellow in our cup final his 22nd game of the year and we miss him for the first round. Three cautions in 22 games is hardly a poor discipline record I hope the other leagues are following those same rules regarding yellow cards, not only accumulated during the regular season, but also their cup games aswell. If they are not, then the FVSL is handcuffing ourselves, and not playing on a level playing field.

Just one player/coach with some big holes to fill this weekend

[Aves]

Originally Posted by cainy

Aves has 2 yellow cards. Now upon entering the provincial cup, he would be clear to play, and the slate wiped clean. Shouldn't the same rules apply to our cup ( pak) like the islands Jackson cup or VMSLs Imperial cup. ,

ok then, so do league game yellows carry over into the imperial and visl league cup play or not? This is a good question.

If you have 2 and enter the imperial cup and pick up your 3rd of the year (1st in cup play) in the imperial cup final are you handed a one game suspension and have to miss the next game in prov cup play?
If not ....

This is the key point that could merit an appeal.

anyone?

beating a comatose horse?

grasping,

Aves

[Skip]

Originally Posted by Aves

beating a comatose horse?

Yes.

Hey.....you asked!

I think all three leagues are playing the same way. Any team (within any league) who chooses to play someone this weekend who has picked up their third yellow in recent cup competition would be risking their match IMO.

KNVB, you've suddenly become quiet on the matter. Have the Surrey United brass put you on a gag order??

The FVSL has Crafty Cokcney taking a look at every last detail of every roster submitted. If there's some funny business, he'll find it!

~Skip

[J_B]

Originally Posted by Aves

ok then, so do league game yellows carry over into the imperial and visl league cup play or not? This is a good question.

If you have 2 and enter the imperial cup and pick up your 3rd of the year (1st in cup play) in the imperial cup final are you handed a one game suspension and have to miss the next game in prov cup play?
If not ....

This is the key point that could merit an appeal.

anyone?

beating a comatose horse?

grasping,

Aves

From my understanding players who have 2 yellows in league play and get the thrid in cup play must sit out the next match no matter if it is a cup, league or provincail match.

Cheers
JB

[Aves]

Originally Posted by Skip

!

I think all three leagues are playing the same way.

Originally Posted by J_B

From my understanding players who have 2 yellows in league play and get the thrid in cup play must sit out the next match no matter if it is a cup, league or provincail match.

Cheers
JB

I think...my understanding.....
cheers boys but who knows this definitively?
Written down somewhere?

flagellating the coma Colt,

Aves


join the movement:Free Aves!

[knvb]

No gag Skip, I've told you what I 'thought' I knew. I was and still am under the impression that if you haven't been put on suspension before the provincials starts that you are free to play with a clean slate, as it were. And by not on suspension I mean, for example,you haven't already sat 1 game of a two game suspension.

How dumb is it to handcuff a team in your respective league with a league yellow card issue in the BC's? Are the teams not there to represent the league? Reds are one thing... but yellows?



Free Aves

[Dude]

Aloha.

Sounds like Aves finally has a legitimate moan. Hopefully something happens at the BCSA level to even out the playing field.

Gotta run…need to get some work done this morning before hitting the Maui links w/ Sixfyv at 10:00…so fcuk off.

Aloha,

Dude.


PS: Good luck in Victoria lads.

[Aves]

Just checked out the discipline info on the vmsl and visl sites.
The visl shows the number of yellows accumulated by all players...9 or 10 players with 3 playing for vantreights, bays, gordonhead, gorge.
The vmsl page shows suspensions with how many games, but does not give the background info as to why + there are virtually no premier players listed recently....leading one to think that these suspensions are for reds only (all include fines) and not for accumulated yellows. One would think that if the visl has 10 or more sitting on 3 that the 8 vmsl teams would have a few players sitting with 3 yellows...but again this info is not published.
I also checked out the bcsa discipline book and it says that league suspensions carry over into cup play, so if a player has 3 yellows he is technically suspended form play in his league, and therefore would be on the league suspension list which gets forwarded to bcsa before cup play begins.
So I guess it is clear what is supposed to happen.


but it does raise the question: do leagues have the option of allowing players with 3 yellows to miss their next league game instead of placing them on the "league suspended" list which gets sent on to bcsa? I guess this is a slippery slope but it certainly makes sense from a fairness - what is just perspective.

I would assume that yellows picked up in imperial cup play+ visl cup play count toward the 3 yellow rule and therefore these players should be included on the vmsl suspension list and be sitting out in the bc's. If this is being done then end of story...if not then I've got reason to object and all league competition yellows shouldn't be included. I'm not saying the other leagues aren't doing this but it would be nice to know the answer.

Not much wiggle room for freeing Aves.

Guess I'll take in the SU masters game at 10 and carry on to South Surrey for 2:00 and enjoy the competition from the sidelines.

vying for the level playing field,

cheers,
Aves in chains

[thecobra13]

As an Island player...this whole card situation is confusing at best!! I personally think that if a player is currently under suspension (not from a yellow in their last game) that they should have a clean sheet to play!! The league is ends up punishing their own representatives at BCs??? Should be the same for all leagues. We all want to play our best team, and compete against the best team possible...not against a team depleted by a couple minor suspensions.
League suspensions (3 yellows) should be carried over into LEAGUE PLAY.
But....my opinion is minor....as is everyones here.
Any FINAL decision yet?? As us Island teams are in the dark. Wouldn't want anyone going on b/c of a protest. Win the game on the field.
Looking forward to this Kensington Park...ha....shocker??

[Regs]

Aves,

Nice detective work.

This probably won't help you now but it would be nice if the BCSA took note of this situation (which has been happening for years as far as I can remember) and implemented some clear and concise policies/rules for future years when it comes time for provincials.

There needs to be some sort of system in place where leagues are given a set date and must report all yellows and reds given... say March 1st... and must update this list weekly leading up to the first round of the provincials.

As it is now, it is currently too easy for League Officials to 'pull some strings' and not report suspensions until they feel like it. And really, could you blame them for wanting to make sure member teams representing their league have the best possible chance to win the BCs?

I know that in years gone by, Peg has benefitted by late suspension rulings that were applied to the start of the next season.

Of course, this all wouldn't be an issue if we didn't have refs like Walks, Rene, PNE, and Whistle Blower handing out cards like candy

[knvb]

Like candy? That is the understatement of the season. I hear Uppal is going in for rotator cuff surgery...

Lets not only question the rule and forget about, really, the root of the problem and that is we all still have the utterly ridiculous rule of having only 3 freaking cards equal a 1 game suspension and two more 2. That's honestly not very many for a 19 possibly 21 league games (if you're lucky) and 4 cup (again...if you're so lucky)

Free Aves Brown.

[Peter]

The issuing ref's (timely) report comes in to play here, and then the respective league's ability to tabulate all the cards and then disseminate the supensions. There are lots of things that can delay the process and unless the BCSA were to dictate protocol there will always be a way for players to slip through the cracks.

[Regs]

One solution would be for the BCSA to set-up an online database of every senior player registered in the province. Referees would 'submit' cards issued the night of each game played. League officials would also be able to access the database (filtered on player IDs pertaining to their league only) to confirm length of any suspensions handed out.

The online application would also have a web output option that leagues could incorporate into their own websites for reporting suspensions to their members. Ideally, league officials would be able to set how much info was published and be able to control some basic colour formatting options.

It's really not a difficult thing to do other than the time and money needed to initially set-up such a system.