VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10

dezza · 06-12-2009, 01:00 PM

There was a vote at the Div 1 meeting last night on alignment for next season. The options were one group of 20 teams, or two groups of 10. The vote was 7-4 in favour of two groups with 2 abstaining.

For the 2009/10 season, there will be two groups of Div 1.
At the end of the season:
- The winner of each group will be promoted to Premier
- The 2nd place teams from the two groups will playoff and the winner will be promoted to Premier
- The bottom 4 teams from each group will be relegated to Div 2
- The 5th place teams from the two groups will playoff and the loser will be relegated to Div 2

Here are the groupings:

DIVISION 1 A
Serbian White Eagles
Akal FC
Lobbans FC
RCIU Athletics
IFC Polonia
Bombastic FC
Westside Rino
Green Devils FC
GN Sporting
Wickham FC

DIVISION 1 B
Sporting Club
Punjab Hurricanes
Cliff Avenue
Binger's Army
Vancouver Olympics
FC Romania
AFC Leopards
Primo MF
NK Hrvat
Sikh Temple

Regs · 06-12-2009, 01:09 PM

So in 2010/11 Div 1 will have how many teams?

3 teams go up.
9 teams go down.

That leaves 8 teams with relegated Premier and promoted Div 2 teams still to be added.

Premier will be losing 4 teams to the 'super league' so I suppose no Premier teams will be relegated. Is this correct?

dezza · 06-12-2009, 01:16 PM

1 relegated from Prem
1 promoted from Div 2

10 teams in each of Premier and Div 1 from 2010/11 forward.

Regs · 06-12-2009, 01:25 PM

Wow, Div 1 should be so much more competitive after all of this plays out.

termatofylakas · 06-12-2009, 01:58 PM

Kind of a joke for the div 2 part but what are you going to do. Three groups and only 1 goes up, kind of stupid. I'm all for the game and league getting better and more competitive but from 30 teams only 1 going up kind of a wasted season for the rest. Are you sure it's only 10 teams for div 1 dezza?

dezza · 06-12-2009, 02:50 PM

Yes, I'm 100% sure it's only 10 teams for div 1.

The main reason the vote kept div 1 as two groups of 10 this season was Azzi stressed how much more difficult it is to schedule a non-uniform division. (20 teams in one group would have a 19-game schedule). Short of the BC Premier League collapsing, I can't see anyway he will allow Premier or Div 1 to expand beyond 10 teams after this.

Captain Shamrock · 06-12-2009, 10:32 PM

The whole thing is ****ed up.........can anyone tell me WHY they have chosen this wonderful route?

TS · 06-13-2009, 12:57 AM

That's totally FCUKED!
So how does promo work from div 2 to div 1? Do the group winners play a round-robin?
That would mean 10 teams in Prem, 10 in Div 1, and 40 in div 2?

termatofylakas · 06-13-2009, 01:22 AM

Probably 10, 10, 20 and 20 TS. Like I said earlier only 1 team going up out of 30 from div 2 is bush. Why not just relegate the bottom 5 from each group and have the 5th place team in each group have a playoff if you are making such drastic changes? Then the group winners from div 2 can go up like usual.

Either way you look at it it is fcuked up as CS said.

termatofylakas · 06-13-2009, 01:29 AM

Actually now that I've read dezza's original post again, he's made a typo somewhere. If the 5th place teams playoff then three teams should go up since 11 teams will go down? Now this is really confusing...

dezza · 06-13-2009, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by termatofylakas

Actually now that I've read dezza's original post again, he's made a typo somewhere. If the 5th place teams playoff then three teams should go up since 11 teams will go down? Now this is really confusing...

You're right, that should have said 6th place (or 5th from bottom) teams playoff.

Also, for anyone who's bitching and moaning now, you or your team rep should have voted this down at the AGM last month! It was all laid out in the restructuring proposal that was part of the vote to join the BC Premier League.

Captain Shamrock · 06-13-2009, 10:34 AM

I can't believe ANYONE would vote for this new system. So what happens when one of the top 4 Premier teams declines to go in the new 'super' league? An absolute ****ing shambles. Can ANYONE on here give a GOOD reason why this new set-up is going to help soccer in B.C. ? Will we now be National Champions within the next two years?

It is a fcuking nightmare and there is no other way to describe it.

Dezza, for the record, our team DID vote it down and on top of that, the top 4 teams in the VMSL voted it down.........how the **** did get passed?

dezza · 06-13-2009, 10:40 AM

Captain, that's kind of interesting because at the meeting Azzi said that there was a premier-only meeting held prior and the Prem teams supported joining the BC league. If the top 4 teams were against it, why didn't they take the opportunity to take the floor and voice their opinion before the vote? Surely they could have explained why this is a bad idea and swayed a few votes of the lower div teams.

Regs · 06-13-2009, 10:42 AM

I'm surprised the top 4 teams in the VMSL would vote it down... WTF do they care? Under what basis did they have issues with the proposal?

Quote:

Will we now be National Champions within the next two years?

I say sooner than that...

Captain Shamrock · 06-13-2009, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dezza

Captain, that's kind of interesting because at the meeting Azzi said that there was a premier-only meeting held prior and the Prem teams supported joining the BC league. If the top 4 teams were against it, why didn't they take the opportunity to take the floor and voice their opinion before the vote? Surely they could have explained why this is a bad idea and swayed a few votes of the lower div teams.

It would have been nice to know.......I know we had a representative at both meetings and we were very much against it......perhaps some of the information wasn't received? I don't know but I do know it is going to be a nightmare.

soccerking · 06-13-2009, 12:03 PM

Captain Shamrock is right...what the premier teams voted at the first meeting was to form a committee to discuss the new league...a vote was held at the AGM and there were premier teams against the new league...including SUF ...Inter .... and a couple of other sides....as a rep of SUF...I thought that this proposal was rammed down our throats without any thought to structure...and decisions being made without thought or debate...this year was a competitive season for VMSL...provincial games were well attended as was the Imperial Cup...... VMSL could have done a better job of promoting the league by scheduling games on Sat and Sun or even double headers...... just use Hastings Bowl as an example of the turn outs we could have...the new BC Premier league will not be a new improved league like the powers that be seem to think

Captain Shamrock · 06-13-2009, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by soccerking

Captain Shamrock is right...what the premier teams voted at the first meeting was to form a committee to discuss the new league...a vote was held at the AGM and there were premier teams against the new league...including SUF ...Inter .... and a couple of other sides....as a rep of SUF...I thought that this proposal was rammed down our throats without any thought to structure...and decisions being made without thought or debate...this year was a competitive season for VMSL...provincial games were well attended as was the Imperial Cup...... VMSL could have done a better job of promoting the league by scheduling games on Sat and Sun or even double headers...... just use Hastings Bowl as an example of the turn outs we could have...the new BC Premier league will not be a new improved league like the powers that be seem to think

Spot on, Soccerking. I'm just waiting for one of the groups who voted for it to come on here and explain how this is going to be better for everyone involved. I'm guessing I'll be collecting dust here waiting for a response.

evergreen · 06-13-2009, 03:50 PM

I've noticed that in the AGM's most people just vote the way the committee (how does this committee get formed anyway?) or Azzi wants it to go. There seems to be a bombshell proposal dropped that gives everyone a minute or 2 to think about it while a couple of people muster up a question or 2 and then if there's a few seconds of silence, a vote goes ahead. I would rather see the restructure proposals released a week ahead of time so some thoughtful discussion can be had and a meaningful vote at the AGM.

bulljive · 06-13-2009, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Captain Shamrock

I can't believe ANYONE would vote for this new system. So what happens when one of the top 4 Premier teams declines to go in the new 'super' league? An absolute ****ing shambles. Can ANYONE on here give a GOOD reason why this new set-up is going to help soccer in B.C. ? Will we now be National Champions within the next two years?

It is a fcuking nightmare and there is no other way to describe it.

Dezza, for the record, our team DID vote it down and on top of that, the top 4 teams in the VMSL voted it down.........how the **** did get passed?

Apparently from what I have heard on the FVSL side, teams will not be allowed to say no to this super league if they finish top 4. What the means I don't know, perhaps a fine. Lets be honest here the only team really capable of handling this is Peace Arch, as players will go there and they have the facilities and finances to enjoy this opportunity.

oranje · 06-13-2009, 08:27 PM

The chickens have come home to roost. At the organization meeting 6 weeks prior to the AGM, the Premier teams were told it was to be a 12 team super league with 6 spots to the VMSL and 3 spots to each of the VISL and FVSL.

We were asked to vote in principle as to whether we liked the idea of a super league. We did, in principle, when there were more spots to the VMSL and with the promise of more information.

So, what was passed at the AGM was far different than what we were told 6 weeks earlier and no updates were given in the interim. It was sprung upon us as a fait accompli at the AGM.

A number of questions were asked at the organization meeting about how it was to work and how we we were going to finance travel, sort out provincial spots etc.

A committee was formed, how, is anyone's guess. Sandy and WAB were on the committee and I respect them both.

When it got to the AGM, none of the promised answers were forthcoming either before or during the AGM.

Representatives from Columbus, RCIU, Inter and others asked several questions about the process.

The vast majority voted FOR the proposal based on the executive's assurances that it was the best for soccer in the province. These people were vastly from Div 1, 2, and 3 teams who accepted the representations without much thought.

Whenever the executive was challenged at the AGM, we were told that the question/issue was irrelevant and would be sorted out "later." We were given motherhood statements about how the changes were for the good of the game.

It reminded me of a summer job I had where I worked in the fishing industry. We went on strike and were told by the union bargaining committee during one of the votes that "if we supported our bargaining committee" we would vote how they told us. Thinking for yourself was not allowed.

Unfortunately, the representatives from the premier clubs were voices in the wilderness.

Now the lower divisions are faced with realizing that it is not such a good deal after all.

I told you so.

06-12-2009, 01:00 PM	#1 (permalink)
dezza Member Joined: Feb 2005 Location: Vancouver Posts: 685 Tokens: 1,000.00 Images: 10	VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 There was a vote at the Div 1 meeting last night on alignment for next season. The options were one group of 20 teams, or two groups of 10. The vote was 7-4 in favour of two groups with 2 abstaining. For the 2009/10 season, there will be two groups of Div 1. At the end of the season: - The winner of each group will be promoted to Premier - The 2nd place teams from the two groups will playoff and the winner will be promoted to Premier - The bottom 4 teams from each group will be relegated to Div 2 - The 5th place teams from the two groups will playoff and the loser will be relegated to Div 2 Here are the groupings: DIVISION 1 A Serbian White Eagles Akal FC Lobbans FC RCIU Athletics IFC Polonia Bombastic FC Westside Rino Green Devils FC GN Sporting Wickham FC DIVISION 1 B Sporting Club Punjab Hurricanes Cliff Avenue Binger's Army Vancouver Olympics FC Romania AFC Leopards Primo MF NK Hrvat Sikh Temple

06-12-2009, 01:09 PM	#2 (permalink)
Regs Member A Total Bastard Joined: Jun 2001 Location: TTP Headquarters Posts: 14,354 Tokens: 1,000.00 Blog Entries: 1 Images: 233	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 So in 2010/11 Div 1 will have how many teams? 3 teams go up. 9 teams go down. That leaves 8 teams with relegated Premier and promoted Div 2 teams still to be added. Premier will be losing 4 teams to the 'super league' so I suppose no Premier teams will be relegated. Is this correct? If you could... Would You?

06-12-2009, 01:16 PM	#3 (permalink)
dezza Member Joined: Feb 2005 Location: Vancouver Posts: 685 Tokens: 1,000.00 Images: 10	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 1 relegated from Prem 1 promoted from Div 2 10 teams in each of Premier and Div 1 from 2010/11 forward.

06-12-2009, 01:25 PM	#4 (permalink)
Regs Member A Total Bastard Joined: Jun 2001 Location: TTP Headquarters Posts: 14,354 Tokens: 1,000.00 Blog Entries: 1 Images: 233	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 Wow, Div 1 should be so much more competitive after all of this plays out. If you could... Would You?

06-12-2009, 01:58 PM	#5 (permalink)
termatofylakas Member Joined: Sep 2003 Location: Boonies Posts: 1,001 Tokens: 1,000.00	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 Kind of a joke for the div 2 part but what are you going to do. Three groups and only 1 goes up, kind of stupid. I'm all for the game and league getting better and more competitive but from 30 teams only 1 going up kind of a wasted season for the rest. Are you sure it's only 10 teams for div 1 dezza?

06-12-2009, 02:50 PM	#6 (permalink)
dezza Member Joined: Feb 2005 Location: Vancouver Posts: 685 Tokens: 1,000.00 Images: 10	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 Yes, I'm 100% sure it's only 10 teams for div 1. The main reason the vote kept div 1 as two groups of 10 this season was Azzi stressed how much more difficult it is to schedule a non-uniform division. (20 teams in one group would have a 19-game schedule). Short of the BC Premier League collapsing, I can't see anyway he will allow Premier or Div 1 to expand beyond 10 teams after this.

06-12-2009, 10:32 PM	#7 (permalink)
Captain Shamrock Premium Member A Better Bastard Joined: Jul 2001 Location: Richmond Posts: 13,525 Tokens: 0	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 The whole thing is ****ed up.........can anyone tell me WHY they have chosen this wonderful route?

06-13-2009, 12:57 AM	#8 (permalink)
TS Premium Member A Better Bastard Joined: Jun 2002 Location: Lower East Side Posts: 334 Tokens: 1,000.00	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 That's totally FCUKED! So how does promo work from div 2 to div 1? Do the group winners play a round-robin? That would mean 10 teams in Prem, 10 in Div 1, and 40 in div 2? I'M ALL IN.

06-13-2009, 01:22 AM	#9 (permalink)
termatofylakas Member Joined: Sep 2003 Location: Boonies Posts: 1,001 Tokens: 1,000.00	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 Probably 10, 10, 20 and 20 TS. Like I said earlier only 1 team going up out of 30 from div 2 is bush. Why not just relegate the bottom 5 from each group and have the 5th place team in each group have a playoff if you are making such drastic changes? Then the group winners from div 2 can go up like usual. Either way you look at it it is fcuked up as CS said.

06-13-2009, 01:29 AM	#10 (permalink)
termatofylakas Member Joined: Sep 2003 Location: Boonies Posts: 1,001 Tokens: 1,000.00	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 Actually now that I've read dezza's original post again, he's made a typo somewhere. If the 5th place teams playoff then three teams should go up since 11 teams will go down? Now this is really confusing...

06-13-2009, 10:34 AM	#12 (permalink)
Captain Shamrock Premium Member A Better Bastard Joined: Jul 2001 Location: Richmond Posts: 13,525 Tokens: 0	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 I can't believe ANYONE would vote for this new system. So what happens when one of the top 4 Premier teams declines to go in the new 'super' league? An absolute **ing shambles. Can ANYONE on here give a GOOD reason why this new set-up is going to help soccer in B.C. ? Will we now be National Champions within the next two years? It is a fcuking nightmare and there is no other way to describe it. Dezza, for the record, our team DID vote it down and on top of that, the top 4 teams in the VMSL voted it down.........how the ** did get passed?

06-13-2009, 10:40 AM	#13 (permalink)
dezza Member Joined: Feb 2005 Location: Vancouver Posts: 685 Tokens: 1,000.00 Images: 10	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 Captain, that's kind of interesting because at the meeting Azzi said that there was a premier-only meeting held prior and the Prem teams supported joining the BC league. If the top 4 teams were against it, why didn't they take the opportunity to take the floor and voice their opinion before the vote? Surely they could have explained why this is a bad idea and swayed a few votes of the lower div teams.

06-13-2009, 12:03 PM	#16 (permalink)
soccerking Member Joined: Sep 2007 Location: surrey Posts: 6 Tokens: 1,000.00	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 Captain Shamrock is right...what the premier teams voted at the first meeting was to form a committee to discuss the new league...a vote was held at the AGM and there were premier teams against the new league...including SUF ...Inter .... and a couple of other sides....as a rep of SUF...I thought that this proposal was rammed down our throats without any thought to structure...and decisions being made without thought or debate...this year was a competitive season for VMSL...provincial games were well attended as was the Imperial Cup...... VMSL could have done a better job of promoting the league by scheduling games on Sat and Sun or even double headers...... just use Hastings Bowl as an example of the turn outs we could have...the new BC Premier league will not be a new improved league like the powers that be seem to think

06-13-2009, 03:50 PM	#18 (permalink)
evergreen Member Joined: Mar 2006 Location: vancouver Posts: 39 Tokens: 1,000.00	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 I've noticed that in the AGM's most people just vote the way the committee (how does this committee get formed anyway?) or Azzi wants it to go. There seems to be a bombshell proposal dropped that gives everyone a minute or 2 to think about it while a couple of people muster up a question or 2 and then if there's a few seconds of silence, a vote goes ahead. I would rather see the restructure proposals released a week ahead of time so some thoughtful discussion can be had and a meaningful vote at the AGM.

06-13-2009, 08:27 PM	#20 (permalink)
oranje Premium Member A Better Bastard Joined: Nov 2006 Location: Philips Stadion Posts: 269 Tokens: 1,000.00 Images: 59	Re: VMSL Div 1 Alignment 2009/10 The chickens have come home to roost. At the organization meeting 6 weeks prior to the AGM, the Premier teams were told it was to be a 12 team super league with 6 spots to the VMSL and 3 spots to each of the VISL and FVSL. We were asked to vote in principle as to whether we liked the idea of a super league. We did, in principle, when there were more spots to the VMSL and with the promise of more information. So, what was passed at the AGM was far different than what we were told 6 weeks earlier and no updates were given in the interim. It was sprung upon us as a fait accompli at the AGM. A number of questions were asked at the organization meeting about how it was to work and how we we were going to finance travel, sort out provincial spots etc. A committee was formed, how, is anyone's guess. Sandy and WAB were on the committee and I respect them both. When it got to the AGM, none of the promised answers were forthcoming either before or during the AGM. Representatives from Columbus, RCIU, Inter and others asked several questions about the process. The vast majority voted FOR the proposal based on the executive's assurances that it was the best for soccer in the province. These people were vastly from Div 1, 2, and 3 teams who accepted the representations without much thought. Whenever the executive was challenged at the AGM, we were told that the question/issue was irrelevant and would be sorted out "later." We were given motherhood statements about how the changes were for the good of the game. It reminded me of a summer job I had where I worked in the fishing industry. We went on strike and were told by the union bargaining committee during one of the votes that "if we supported our bargaining committee" we would vote how they told us. Thinking for yourself was not allowed. Unfortunately, the representatives from the premier clubs were voices in the wilderness. Now the lower divisions are faced with realizing that it is not such a good deal after all. I told you so.

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