VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight....

**BJB** · 07-25-2006, 10:31 AM

There is a VMSL Meeting Tonight for Premier Teams.

On the agenda...

1) Reducing the Premier division down to 10 teams....

2) Removing the every team in premier needs to have a cat team rule.

I believe these were the 2 topics that are going to be discussed, as it's on my home computer and not work. I will have more details for you later on tonite.

PS Any ttp'ers going to this thing tonite??

Keeper · 07-25-2006, 01:09 PM

1) Yes.
2) Yes.

Probably nothing will be implemented until 2007/08. No?

aekara · 07-25-2006, 06:42 PM

BJB let us know how the meeting goes

**knvb** · 07-26-2006, 10:59 AM

Here is what I hear was talked about from a friend of friend of a girl who was going with this guy named BJB who works at 31 flavors. The Div 1 Cat will stay for now and most teams will be fielding a team...

They want to reduce the premier div down to 12. Everyone was in favour of it, it was just a matter of how do you relegate/promote to get there. It was decided (as long as the div 1 teams are ok with this) That there would be 3 teams relegated from Premier down to Division 1. The last place team off of Side A and B as usual. The 2nd to last place teams on either side will then have to play each other in a home and home playoff set.

Last year for instance Westside and Burnaby would be relegated as they were, but for the purpose of contraction, the Trollups and AFC would have to have played a playoff. Now, the kicker if you're in Div 1... only one team would come up. They'll need to get that approved I'm sure.

There was also talk with the 12 team premier that we'll see one standing and not the side a/b rubbish we have now. Each team would play each other twice, 22 games total. It'll be easy to do with 1 or 2 mid week matches per team through-out the year.

Ala Regs, discuss.

**Dapotayto** · 07-26-2006, 12:39 PM

Why not relegate four teams from Premier and bring up the standard two from division 1? If they are serious about wanting to improve the quality of the Premier division then relegating four shouldn't be an issue.

**knvb** · 07-26-2006, 12:47 PM

Good point, but with that though there is the ever present "the other side is weaker" augment. This way at least they can keep it somewhat status quo(sp) and not have to run a mini tourney to decide the other 2 teams.

Toze · 07-26-2006, 02:04 PM

Division One teams - if given the option - would never agree to this.

Imagine playing all season, battling in all sorts of conditions, and finishing on top of Division One, only to lose a one game playoff verse the other Division One winner. What if you have injuries, Cup play going on or can't field anything close to your best team on some day in Mid-April. That would be a shame.

Bottom four Premier teams should go. They have 19 games NOT to finish six or seventh in their side.

**knvb** · 07-26-2006, 02:08 PM

Even if it were for only the 1 year and it’s for the over all benefit of the league?

**BJB** · 07-26-2006, 02:12 PM

I would have like to seen a playoff between the 3rd last place premier team and the top division 1 team. That's how they do it in some european leagues.

**Dapotayto** · 07-26-2006, 02:17 PM

On a related note, if the premier divison were to be downsized, would division 1 also be? Or would div. 1 be expected to simply incoporate two more teams to make a twenty-two team total?

Keeper · 07-26-2006, 02:24 PM

I completely agree with Toze.

The league should reward success in Div 1 with promotion for both top teams, and punish mediocrity in Premier with demotion for the bottom 4.

Think about it: with a single playoff game, you're punishing a successful team inspite of all the hard work they put in all season (remember how competetive the top 3-4 teams have been in Div 1 lately). Simultaneously, you're rewarding a lame squad who hasn't been able to cut it -- purely on the basis of one game.

KNVB, your question ("Even if it were for only the 1 year and it’s for the over all benefit of the league?") can easily be asked of that 4th Premier team to be demoted. If they're good enough, they'll be back up in a year anyway.

2 up, 4 down. It's the right thing to do.

On second thought, does anyone know how the 14 teams were alotted in the first place? Just reverse the process.

Was it 3 up, 1 down? Or 4 up, 2 down? Just do the opposite now.

Keeper · 07-26-2006, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dapotayto

On a related note, if the premier divison were to be downsized, would division 1 also be? Or would div. 1 be expected to simply incoporate two more teams to make a twenty-two team total?

Hey man, just one thing at a time. We don't need the likes of you making things more complicated for Azzi.

Aren't you due for another 3 week vacation yet?

**knvb** · 07-26-2006, 02:42 PM

Quote:

KNVB, your question ("Even if it were for only the 1 year and it’s for the over all benefit of the league?") can easily be asked of that 4th Premier team to be demoted. If they're good enough, they'll be back up in a year anyway.

2 up, 4 down. It's the right thing to do.

Fair enough... and I kinda agree as long as we're not on of the 4 that is. Then it would just be a stupid idea.

I'm just throwing it out there.

Sandman · 07-26-2006, 02:45 PM

Quote:

On second thought, does anyone know how the 14 teams were alotted in the first place? Just reverse the process.

Was it 3 up, 1 down? Or 4 up, 2 down? Just do the opposite now.

4 spots came via:
-The two top teams from the FVSL (Surrey Utd and Surrey FC)
-The other two came from a four team tournament/playoff between the two relegated teams in Premier and the two 2nd place teams in Div 1. (Norvan and Trollers successfully came out of this in 1999)

Its a tough pill to swallow for Div 1 to only have 1 team get promoted (eventhough beneficial for the league)..........how about:
-Two last place teams from Premier get relegated
-Two top teams from Div 1 playoff/tournament with the two 6th place teams. Like Keeper said.....just reverse the process from 1999.

No argument.....its all decided on the pitch.

Sandman

Keeper · 07-26-2006, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by knvb

Fair enough... and I kinda agree as long as we're not on of the 4 that is. Then it would just be a stupid idea.

Agreed. And that's the problem: all the Premier teams (and Div 1 teams, for that matter) are just out to cover their butt. So this is one of those times that Azzi needs to be his (unfortunately) usual self and assert the power of the league over the teams in order to do what is right and not what's best for the Premier teams.

Keeper · 07-26-2006, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandman

-Two last place teams from Premier get relegated
-Two top teams from Div 1 playoff/tournament with the two 6th place teams. Like Keeper said.....just reverse the process from 1999.

Now that's the way to go.

J_B · 07-26-2006, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandman

4 spots came via:
-The two top teams from the FVSL (Surrey Utd and Surrey FC)
-The other two came from a four team tournament/playoff between the two relegated teams in Premier and the two 2nd place teams in Div 1. (Norvan and Trollers successfully came out of this in 1999)

Its a tough pill to swallow for Div 1 to only have 1 team get promoted (eventhough beneficial for the league)..........how about:
-Two last place teams from Premier get relegated
-Two top teams from Div 1 playoff/tournament with the two 6th place teams. Like Keeper said.....just reverse the process from 1999.

No argument.....its all decided on the pitch.

Sandman

Sandman,

Has nailed this one on the button. Any team going up or down shouldn't argue this, unless it is Surrey but they would bitch regardless

.

Cheers
JB

Toze · 07-26-2006, 03:25 PM

Sandman's idea is not a bad one... however, it still does not promote the two Division One winners and makes them continue to fight for a Premier spot. In fact neither could end up in Premier.

Also, in 1999 the Division One winners were Promoted (wasn't Indo one of them?) and the second place Division One teams went into the Playoff. Norvan was one of those second place teams.

**Regs** · 07-26-2006, 03:49 PM

If the top 2 Div 1 teams can't beat 2 of the worst teams in the premier, do they deserve to go up? What's the point?

That's always been my problem when THAT argument gets brought up.

**BJB** · 07-26-2006, 03:51 PM

I agree with Regs.

07-25-2006, 10:31 AM	#1 (permalink)
BJB Joined: Sep 2001 Location: Vancouver Posts: 1,681 Images: 1 TTP Friends: (0)	VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... There is a VMSL Meeting Tonight for Premier Teams. On the agenda... 1) Reducing the Premier division down to 10 teams.... 2) Removing the every team in premier needs to have a cat team rule. I believe these were the 2 topics that are going to be discussed, as it's on my home computer and not work. I will have more details for you later on tonite. PS Any ttp'ers going to this thing tonite?? __________________ Croatia 3 Wins 2 Draws 0 Loses against I-T-A-L-I-A!!!!

07-25-2006, 01:09 PM	#2 (permalink)
Keeper Member Joined: Jul 2001 Location: - Posts: 5,532 Images: 1172 TTP Friends: (0)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... 1) Yes. 2) Yes. Probably nothing will be implemented until 2007/08. No? __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

07-25-2006, 06:42 PM	#3 (permalink)
aekara Member Joined: Nov 2005 Location: BC Posts: 41 TTP Friends: (0)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... BJB let us know how the meeting goes

07-26-2006, 10:59 AM	#4 (permalink)
knvb Kick'n it old school... A Total Bastard Joined: Aug 2001 Location: Langley Posts: 10,585 Images: 229 TTP Friends: (6)	Here is what I hear was talked about from a friend of friend of a girl who was going with this guy named BJB who works at 31 flavors. The Div 1 Cat will stay for now and most teams will be fielding a team... They want to reduce the premier div down to 12. Everyone was in favour of it, it was just a matter of how do you relegate/promote to get there. It was decided (as long as the div 1 teams are ok with this) That there would be 3 teams relegated from Premier down to Division 1. The last place team off of Side A and B as usual. The 2nd to last place teams on either side will then have to play each other in a home and home playoff set. Last year for instance Westside and Burnaby would be relegated as they were, but for the purpose of contraction, the Trollups and AFC would have to have played a playoff. Now, the kicker if you're in Div 1... only one team would come up. They'll need to get that approved I'm sure. There was also talk with the 12 team premier that we'll see one standing and not the side a/b rubbish we have now. Each team would play each other twice, 22 games total. It'll be easy to do with 1 or 2 mid week matches per team through-out the year. Ala Regs, discuss. Last edited by knvb; 07-26-2006 at 11:07 AM.

07-26-2006, 12:39 PM	#5 (permalink)
Dapotayto Premium Member A Better Bastard Joined: Oct 2001 Location: Uranus Posts: 2,292 Images: 7 TTP Friends: (0)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... Why not relegate four teams from Premier and bring up the standard two from division 1? If they are serious about wanting to improve the quality of the Premier division then relegating four shouldn't be an issue.

07-26-2006, 12:47 PM	#6 (permalink)
knvb Kick'n it old school... A Total Bastard Joined: Aug 2001 Location: Langley Posts: 10,585 Images: 229 TTP Friends: (6)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... Good point, but with that though there is the ever present "the other side is weaker" augment. This way at least they can keep it somewhat status quo(sp) and not have to run a mini tourney to decide the other 2 teams.

07-26-2006, 02:04 PM	#7 (permalink)
Toze Member Joined: Jul 2001 Location: near a river and under a bridge in a trailer park Posts: 68 TTP Friends: (0)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... Division One teams - if given the option - would never agree to this. Imagine playing all season, battling in all sorts of conditions, and finishing on top of Division One, only to lose a one game playoff verse the other Division One winner. What if you have injuries, Cup play going on or can't field anything close to your best team on some day in Mid-April. That would be a shame. Bottom four Premier teams should go. They have 19 games NOT to finish six or seventh in their side.

07-26-2006, 02:08 PM	#8 (permalink)
knvb Kick'n it old school... A Total Bastard Joined: Aug 2001 Location: Langley Posts: 10,585 Images: 229 TTP Friends: (6)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... Even if it were for only the 1 year and it’s for the over all benefit of the league?

07-26-2006, 02:12 PM	#9 (permalink)
BJB Joined: Sep 2001 Location: Vancouver Posts: 1,681 Images: 1 TTP Friends: (0)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... I would have like to seen a playoff between the 3rd last place premier team and the top division 1 team. That's how they do it in some european leagues. __________________ Croatia 3 Wins 2 Draws 0 Loses against I-T-A-L-I-A!!!!

07-26-2006, 02:17 PM	#10 (permalink)
Dapotayto Premium Member A Better Bastard Joined: Oct 2001 Location: Uranus Posts: 2,292 Images: 7 TTP Friends: (0)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... On a related note, if the premier divison were to be downsized, would division 1 also be? Or would div. 1 be expected to simply incoporate two more teams to make a twenty-two team total?

07-26-2006, 02:24 PM	#11 (permalink)
Keeper Member Joined: Jul 2001 Location: - Posts: 5,532 Images: 1172 TTP Friends: (0)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... I completely agree with Toze. The league should reward success in Div 1 with promotion for both top teams, and punish mediocrity in Premier with demotion for the bottom 4. Think about it: with a single playoff game, you're punishing a successful team inspite of all the hard work they put in all season (remember how competetive the top 3-4 teams have been in Div 1 lately). Simultaneously, you're rewarding a lame squad who hasn't been able to cut it -- purely on the basis of one game. KNVB, your question ("Even if it were for only the 1 year and it’s for the over all benefit of the league?") can easily be asked of that 4th Premier team to be demoted. If they're good enough, they'll be back up in a year anyway. 2 up, 4 down. It's the right thing to do. On second thought, does anyone know how the 14 teams were alotted in the first place? Just reverse the process. Was it 3 up, 1 down? Or 4 up, 2 down? Just do the opposite now. __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

07-26-2006, 03:25 PM	#18 (permalink)
Toze Member Joined: Jul 2001 Location: near a river and under a bridge in a trailer park Posts: 68 TTP Friends: (0)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... Sandman's idea is not a bad one... however, it still does not promote the two Division One winners and makes them continue to fight for a Premier spot. In fact neither could end up in Premier. Also, in 1999 the Division One winners were Promoted (wasn't Indo one of them?) and the second place Division One teams went into the Playoff. Norvan was one of those second place teams.

07-26-2006, 03:49 PM	#19 (permalink)
Regs Respect & Honour A Total Bastard Joined: Jun 2001 Location: TTP Headquarters Posts: 12,077 Blog Entries: 1 Images: 233 TTP Friends: (12)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... If the top 2 Div 1 teams can't beat 2 of the worst teams in the premier, do they deserve to go up? What's the point? That's always been my problem when THAT argument gets brought up. __________________ Take the piss (out of someone) vb. British -- to mock, deride, poke fun (at). This vulgarism has been in widespread use since the late 1940s. The original idea evoked by the expression was that of deflating someone, recalling the description of a self-important blusterer as 'all piss and wind.'

07-26-2006, 03:51 PM	#20 (permalink)
BJB Joined: Sep 2001 Location: Vancouver Posts: 1,681 Images: 1 TTP Friends: (0)	Re: VMSL Premier Meeting Tonight.... I agree with Regs. __________________ Croatia 3 Wins 2 Draws 0 Loses against I-T-A-L-I-A!!!!

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