Inter at Nationals 2017

Canucks4Ever

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Sooooo that looks to be a firm NO on Nationals for Aldy...

http://www.canadasoccer.com/schedule-results-s15521

Format changed to a 10 team tourney with 2 groups of 5 it would seem on the Men's side. First plays first from pool A and pool B for the title (second vs. second and so on and so forth for final seeding down the line). I wonder why the adjustment?

Also the website lists the fields as NAP. Langley's not hosting at Willoughby??

(Not sure of there is a better board for this... @Regs any thread for Nationals?)
 
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Coastal 2-1 inter in a preseason friendly. Should have been about 6-1. Inter still shaking off the summer cob webs.
 

Canucks4Ever

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Coastal 2-1 inter in a preseason friendly. Should have been about 6-1. Inter still shaking off the summer cob webs.
I mean sure...

Let's be honest, everyone knows Inter starts in January. They barely squeezed into Provs last season and they're likely to do the same this season. It's just how they roll. Should be interesting to see if they can dial it up for Thanksgiving this year. Look I, personally, am not a fan of Inter. Their antics, etc. bother me and I'm less than keen on them representing BC on the National stage. That being said, objectively speaking, this is what they do. They get up for big games and, more often than not, they get the result. Good luck to Coastal/ND in their return to the FVSL, hopefully they can make Provincials. Beating Inter in preseason though? Pretty much irrelevant. Beat them in April, however, and I will 100% fully tip my hat.
 
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Crazy-K

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Inter will have a terrible season this year in the VMSL don't expect much in nationals from them either. They look awful there getting to old no youth. Also when your team depends on a guy like Milad to be a star you know you have problems.
 

Canucks4Ever

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I'd like to know what happened, too. Optics are bad.
@knvb any insight with this one?

I've heard tell that CSA were being complete f*cks and their demands were way too constrictive to work within. Given the fact the FVSL puts on a damn good event, it seems too bad that they weren't given free reign to put on what I am sure would have been a great show. Always going to be some red tape with a National organization, some justified others not so much. Rumour has it that FVSL wanted to bring in local sponsors that may have conflicted with some CSA sponsors. On that one I've got to side with CSA, Toyota, Bell, etc. pay big money to be the "Official whatever" of Canada Soccer, so I can see them getting offside about a local league throwing up banners for Tim's Telus Store and the Local Chevy Dealership. That being said, I am sure some wiggle room could have been found (isn't CSA sponsored buy Umbro?? Seems tailor made for a Soccer City promotion, no?).

On other things it sounded like the FVSL was right to be somewhat pissed off. Allegedly the CSA was mandating that all the games be played during the day beginning at 9am or something ludicrous (verified by checking the schedule in the link posted to the CSA tournament site). The FVSL apparently had grand plans for matches in prime time. Again, I feel like there should have been some wiggle room here and an agreement brokered. Teams do need to travel home after the final (which goes at 12:30 I believe) and the CSA does do live webcasts, so it would be a bit harsh to have Nova Scotia kicking off at 7pm (11pm Atlantic) for family and friends hoping to watch back home. Then again, I am not sure a BC team would get the same concession if they are in Atlantic Canada (with a 9am kickoff being at 5am Pacific). Seems like CSA has a cookie-cutter tournament template that they like to stick to. You would think that they would be willing to listen to an event host trying to make this a spectacle and generate interest/grow the awareness of the tournament. The only other mitigating factor I can possibly think of is some sort of liability issue with teams needing prescribed amounts of time between matches played?? Other than that, the CSA should really consider giving it's head a shake on that one.

Other items that are rumoured to have scuttled things include not being able to have a beer garden or throw a banquet for the teams. Every tournament I've ever been to on a Provincial/National stage has had a banquet (hell most recreational tournaments have one!) so not sure why the CSA give a shite about that. The beer garden thing I have to assume comes down to liability, but it's 2017 FFS, surely that could have been sorted.

Not sure if my source is right or not on these points; would definitely love some insight from the FVSL.

My main thought though is: Shouldn't the FVSL have known this all before it bid for the event? Pulling out last second looks bad no matter what your reasoning, even if some of it seems totally rational (like the fact the CSA are f*cks). What was the plan? Just take your ball and go home and say best of luck cobbling together a tournament, maybe there won't be a Nationals this year? Think of how bad that could have made soccer in BC look (NOT to be confused with "BC Soccer"). Can't back the FVSL's play on that one.

Also, I can't help but have this lingering feeling that the FVSL would have found a way to battle through everything if Aldy had qualified...
 

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Interesting takes....

Things we don't know:

-When the hosts received the event rule book.
-What exactly the constrictions were.

Here's the thing: the group the FVSL are accountable to are their members. If they can't run an event and make a reasonable profit/fundraising show of it, they would be irresponsible in hosting the event in the first place. If you've ever worked in a nonprofit organization, especially as an elected official, your primary concern is always to your members.

You're right, the Fraser Valley soccer league has put on some very good events over the last few years, and if they were restricted in being able to do the same for this event, and if it would've only cost them valuable volunteer time, and would not of been able to see even a reasonable fundraising effort of this, they're definitely justified in my view and pulling out. I also agree the optics are bad. What we won't ever know, I don't think, are both sides to this.

One thing I learned when it comes to volunteering efforts: you need to treat volunteer time like it's gold. They need to see that what they're working for has an endgame. You can't just throw out a bunch of volunteers to work on event for an organization and not see a return on it. That is the fastest way to losing your volunteers, and the volunteers really are the heart and soul of a nonprofit organization.
 

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So what I'm saying is, hold off the pitchforks and consider that is takes two to tango. The CSA, it would appear, have not helped the situation or themselves.
 

Canucks4Ever

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I think the CSA are fully culpable here, sounds like they don't know their ass from a hole in the ground especially when is comes to throwing events.

All I'm saying is WTF is the FVSL doing pulling out at the last minute? You are right, we don't know what they knew and when, but surely these sorts of things would have come up during the bid process, no? It seems unfathomable that it took until only four months before the event for them to realize that they had no control over certain aspects of it, ESPECIALLY if they deemed them as deal breakers on their end.

Everything you are saying about volunteers is 100% accurate, I doubt you will find anyone on these boards to argue that point. If it was losing scenario then sure, bail out, don't sink your own ship. I just have a hard time believing that they would just pull chute last second when all these "surprises" came up. Were promises from the CSA broken? Were there misunderstandings about what the FVSL did or did not have control over? That would make this much more understandable, if not justifiable. Otherwise it sounds a lot like the FVSL did not do their due diligence and then just pulled a millenial and said "f*ck it" when things weren't going the way they wanted it to.

Who does the responsibility fall on? You say they FVSL has a responsibility only to THEIR members. Well, this is supposed to be the marquee event in all of amateur soccer and (despite how clearly insane the CSA are) the FVSL almost left us all shorn of a host for this. Unacceptable IMO. So then does it fall on BC Soccer to ensure it's members (which we would all fall under) are delivered a tournament, as best as possible, within whatever ridiculous restrictions the CSA are imposing? If I'm BC Soccer I can't see ever trusting the FVSL with something like this again (though not like it sounds like they would want to be...), surely some bridges must have been burned there.

Look I have absolutely no problem with the FVSL saying if we can't do it right, then we're not doing it at all. Fully understand not attaching your name to a substandard product, especially if there is a significant financial and good will outlay involved. It's just the timing aspect. I'm glad BC Soccer was able to throw together a back up plan so we didn't look like complete idiots and have to send the tournament to another Province.
 

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"Look I have absolutely no problem with the FVSL saying if we can't do it right, then we're not doing it at all."

....and that's the crux.

When you are sitting on the Board of Directors of an NPA, and an event hosting opportunity like this comes up, there are three main questions that need to line-up:
1. What will it cost us (usually big volunteer hours plus maybe some short term cash outlay)?

2. What can we gain (fundraising opportunity, cross marketing opportunities, promotion of the league, goodwill)?

3. Can we pull it off?

Well, obviously the league took the info they had in the beginning, and after discussion decided it was worth it and the could pull it off. Then, obviously, after starting the process all the event and marketing limitations came to light and they made a decision that was best for their members to pull out. Those members are the players registered in the FVSL.

Again, a lot we don't know....but one thing we do is that the FVSL puts on a very good event. They are great at this, so the fact they pulled out alone is damning evidence.

Look, I have no issue with you having a different opinion than mine or even being disappointed. I just figure, debate your point. Justify it. Me, I don't want my society wasting any resources, cash and volunteer hours paramount. I really don't care if it means dropping a CSA event if fundraising efforts can't be fullfilled.

It's my opinion, yours is yours. But if your argument "as a member" is you want the league to go forward with he event because otherwise the optics look bad? Well, that's not good enough. It has to actually have more payback than simply saving face.

Speaking of being a member, we are all members of the CSA. We should expect better. They are also fairly cash rich and can afford to pay out and run this event on their own if they had to. So you'd never be left hanging, but you should have serious questions about the top org in the country failing to find a way to collaborate with a willing host league. That is what is disgraceful. It's not fair that the FVSL takes he heat on this.

So, shameful on the part of the CSA from my standpoint. But again, looking at this from the lenses of a NPA, not a player.
 

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How did this jump to the conclusion that the CSA is the faulty party here?

Unless the rules have changed drastically, local sponsorship isn't an issue, the National events I've attended in the past had tonnes of local sponsorship for support.

The CSA President is a local guy - reach out to him directly perhaps if there is a concern?

Even then, BC Soccer is in the picture as well - they are the ones awarded the hosting privileges who then in turn put it out for bid to their membership.
 
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Dude

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Again, takes 2 to tango. It's a CSA event, and if the main issues were related to CSA restrictions in hosting the event, then there is deffinitely "fault" there in the deal falling apart.

I don't necessarily like to look at it as wright or wrong, I look at it as what factors contributed to the FVSL pulling out.

Like @Canucks4Ever made clear: they could have remained host. Sure. Throw an army of volunteers at the event, work with the restrictions, and get nothing out of it but some volunteers you've now burned out. Goodwill is measured in a lot of ways. External optics, and internal optics. First rule: be accountable to your members.

That said, yeah, there is a lot untold here, and you are bang on right, local guy could maybe shed some light, and what exactly was BCSA's role? I have no idea, but I do know the whole pitchfork routine earlier in this thread was blatantly unfair.
 

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Also, new info...I have it on pretty good authority that the FVSL didn't just "bail out". They had done a bunch of prep-work and properly transitioned it all over to a group of retired league execs; guys who have experience and time to see this through. About 4 months of legwork and bookings to support the event. So, what was painted earlier in this thread is definitely not the case. They didn't just "take their ball and go home".

Just saying....the show will go on as the CSA intends.
 

Regs

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LOL, I can hear the rumblings as if I were in the next room

"Regs and his website, what a fcuking idiot/moron, he does nothing or contribute anything to soccer"

"Yeah, he's just pissed that we never followed up with him after he spent 5 hours meeting with us and giving ideas/free advice. I should knock his teeth in"

Me: Everything looks grand from here on my perch.

Fcuk you.

#noonecares

:)
 
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Regs

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Also, new info...I have it on pretty good authority that the FVSL didn't just "bail out". They had done a bunch of prep-work and properly transitioned it all over to a group of retired league execs; guys who have experience and time to see this through. About 4 months of legwork and bookings to support the event. So, what was painted earlier in this thread is definitely not the case. They didn't just "take their ball and go home".

Just saying....the show will go on as the CSA intends.
So you say they didn't bail out, then go on to tell a neat story about old guys taking it on and then... that's it.

I'm supposed to infer from that the toys weren't thrown out of the pram?

 
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