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Regional Tier 3 League

dezza

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Thus, according to you, there are only 5 Chinese operated teams in the lower mainland. ....Interesting... perhaps they are playing somewhere else and you do not know it.

Thanks for putting words in my mouth. I never said that is all the Chinese operated teams in the lower mainland. I specifically said that is where the former Chinese League teams are playing.
 

Soccer Coach

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I've been waiting to chime in for a couple of days and you guys have hit most of the same things I would bring up.

Let's keep this on topic, though I do have to mention the fact that I love the dripping hypocrisy that is a guy who ardently opposes drinking in dressing rooms after a match is in love with the concept of a beer garden. I really don't want to belabor the point, but I couldn't let that one pass ;). Now, on to business.

Some quick hitters to add to the discussion:

The way I read this it is heavily linked to HPL. It fits with the "life cycle" that BC Soccer wants to create for these players.

When you look at the "potential markets" that the document outlines it's clear that BC Soccer would like franchises spread throughout the Province as they mention billeting, etc. Basically, I think the ideal model would be very similar to that of the BCHL. The key to this league's success will be owners who are committed enough to the growth of this sport in this country that they are willing to absorb losses annually for the foreseeable future. When you look at the projections even a "moderately" successful team is taking a loss and that's assuming what I would suggest are fairly optimistic merchandise, etc. revenues for a league with no brand recognition at the moment.

I hope that this league takes the "professional" aspect seriously. All the games should be played in a stadium or stadium like environment. Sorry, no "Trillium" or the like. Venues like this do exist, there's the obvious ones like Swanguard, UBC, UVIC and Coquitlam Town Centre. TRU has a beautiful facility in Kamloops, Chilliwack has a venue, there's Mcleod in Langley and Newton Athletic has the grandstand they put in back in the Kwantlen days. If Coastal/White Rock wants to put a bid in they would IMO have to create a stadium-like venue. There's the grass field in the middle of the track by the baseball diamonds that is a sort of natural amphitheater which could be converted in a stadium-like setting. Problem being that the dressing rooms are across the street. If you want to have a "amateur league run professionally" then you need to commit to the PROFESSIONAL aspect and games on a field at SSAP aren't going to cut it, irrespective of how many tents and banners you put up. By the way I am in by no means trying to pick on Coastal here, they were just the first example I could think of to illustrate my point. In fact most potential franchise hosts would likely be in a similar venue conundrum.

My point is, if you want professional, then you have to act professional and that starts with the perception of the league by both the players and the local community. It may seem like just a trivial thing, but a "stadium" is just one of the many little things that add up to give a league a professional vibe. Ball kids, "Timbits" soccer games at half time, etc., etc. If you have guys getting this one week in Kamloops and then the next week they are changing on the side of the field in Nanaimo and then the next week they are sharing a dressing room with the other team at Andy Livingston your amateur league run professionally becomes very amateur very quickly.

Back to the finances. I developed many a business plan during my undergraduate and if I walked into a presentation with numbers like that I would have been absolutely eviscerated. No appendices to explain their numbers?? Honestly, what on Earth are they based on?? Is that a realistic travel budget? Who would know? Did they investigate what it costs to charter a bus? How about the concession numbers? I would think it would be more realistic to think that it might even COST the team to get food trucks to come to these venues; at best maybe a break even scenario where the vendors come for free but keep their revenues or maybe pay a contingency over a certain dollar amount. What's the industry standard on this? Likely easy enough to find out via a phone call or two and then you could include information on how you reached these numbers. Safe to say I would suggest that they are overestimating their revenues and underestimating their costs.

On the matter of finances, surely these clubs will be entitled to a sell on fee for players. Now this get's sticky when you factor in the college eligibility of the players and any potential MLS Super Draft implications (I do not know what, if any, remuneration teams receive for having a player drafted). The overarching point though is if you allow a team to benefit monetarily from developing players, they will presumably be motivated to continue to do this and thus reinvest in their coaching and development. This is how it works, this is how it grows.

On to implications for other leagues. I think we can all agree this completely torpedoes PCSL and will go toe to toe with the PDL. As many have mentioned VMSL/FVSL/VISL will all continue given that they are Winter leagues and that this new league is designed to be U23. Perhaps loan deals and partnerships can be established to keep these players playing through the winter, but overall the adult leagues will continue be where players go once they have exhausted their professional opportunities. The most interesting affects may be on the College/University league, can these two co-exist? Sounds like they will be fighting for the same player pool. Can players do both? Certainly a question worth asking.

As for the adult leagues, I am not sure where the idea that "the VMSL (etc.) is a stepping stone" concept came from, these leagues are very much the "grave" part of the "cradle to grave" life cycle. Still some pretty good footy at the open level and I would think that the adult leagues actually stand to benefit from players being developed by this new league given once they are beyond U23 they will in all likelihood continue playing.

Does the VMSL (etc.) need to create more community involvement? Yes. Do we need more Cup Day-like events? Yes. Double headers at Trillium with a beer garden? Yes. VMSL/FVSL merger? Yes. I have personally voiced my opinions on this with the VMSL board. The past is the past and the leadership in these leagues is turning over, getting new blood and slowly becoming more open to new ideas. Not a topic for this thread, but worth mentioning. Also, as an aside, home game times are picked by the teams not the league, just for the record...

Lastly, I think we all agree that there is no money to be made in this. 100% it will take community involvement, perhaps some subsidies and lots of committed leadership. There are many more lucrative business ventures that investors could put there money into, but lets hope at least a handful believe that it's worth investing in the future of soccer in this country.

To wrap this up, for now at least, this proposed league is absolutely a step in the right direction for soccer in Canada and in BC. It will have bumps and bruises and may ultimately go tits-up in the end, but BC Soccer appears bound and determined to go ahead with it and power to them. Hopefully it can grow into a similarly productive league to the Ontario league that has churned out some exciting prospects.

This has been nicely written. Well done. I hope that the note is passed to BC Soccer.

I want reinforce that this league is inevitable. You are easily dealing with 350 graduating players from the BCPL and Metro Youth Leagues. In three years it is more than 1,000 players with no place to be absorbed as VMSL and VISL top divisions do not have room for them or similar conditions to what they have been used to it. This is the main reason. A demand has been created and it must be satisfied.

I do really hope that it grows. Guys, ultimately, it should be BC soccer the one administrating a super amateur league. VMSL, FVSL, BMSL, and Richmond leagues should be amalgamated under one management. Promotion/relegation in top divisions with lower divisions having satellite divisions in each municipality. The very top Premier section run as professionally as possible. Preparing young adults to help national team or helping them in their way to a professional contract.

As for the beer garden and the drinking after the games, I do not know if you are referring to me, but they are completely different situations. One is controlled and supervised, the other one is done against the rules and ends up costing us fields. Do it properly. this is just what i am saying.
 

lfc4

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Who the hell is this righteous, know it all, soap boxing wind bag hiding behind the 'Dude' alias?

Has he ever played at an elite level? My guess is no, anybody that did or could would be out doing something productive, not writing a book here.

Back to the Donald.
 

akslop

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Who the hell is this righteous, know it all, soap boxing wind bag hiding behind the 'Dude' alias?

Has he ever played at an elite level? My guess is no, anybody that did or could would be out doing something productive, not writing a book here.

Back to the Donald.

LOL
 

akslop

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From what I have heard, dude, played at the university level here, but you better ask him.

I read on a bathroom stall at china beach in Langley about 15 years ago that he He also taught Chuck Norris the meaning of submission and once climbed a tree to save a kitten But when he got back on the ground the kitten scratched him so he climbed back up the tree and left it there.

He is the most interesting man in the valley.

33b.jpg
 

Dude

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Who the hell is this righteous, know it all, soap boxing wind bag hiding behind the 'Dude' alias?

Has he ever played at an elite level? My guess is no, anybody that did or could would be out doing something productive, not writing a book here.

Back to the Donald.

Smilie face with teeth showing emoticom.

My production today certainly has taken a hit. It must be a slow day tying laces for you to chime in.
 

bulljive

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After finally reading the PDF, seems like a pretty tough sell to me. $12 for game day tickets. I thought this was more of an extension of HPL/free. Not saying this is impossible as I guess they are trying to create the equivalent of say the Surrey Eagles in hockey. Descent fan base and good soccer for cheap. I can see this working with ethnic teams, as it's an instant fan base but struggle to see how surrey United or Coastal would consistently get a big fan base.

I'm hopeful as id love for it to work. Not sure how UBC and SFU co-exist with this unless they have teams in the league themselves like UBC currently does in the PCSL. Lots of questions to be answered and exciting times if this can get some footing.
 

Canucks4Ever

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Not saying this is impossible as I guess they are trying to create the equivalent of say the Surrey Eagles in hockey.

Not sure how UBC and SFU co-exist with this unless they have teams in the league themselves like UBC currently does in the PCSL. Lots of questions to be answered and exciting times if this can get some footing.

Looks like my post was too long for someone to read...;)

No offense taken, it was a book and a half lol
 

djones

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After finally reading the PDF, seems like a pretty tough sell to me. $12 for game day tickets. I thought this was more of an extension of HPL/free. Not saying this is impossible as I guess they are trying to create the equivalent of say the Surrey Eagles in hockey. Descent fan base and good soccer for cheap. I can see this working with ethnic teams, as it's an instant fan base but struggle to see how surrey United or Coastal would consistently get a big fan base.

I'm hopeful as id love for it to work. Not sure how UBC and SFU co-exist with this unless they have teams in the league themselves like UBC currently does in the PCSL. Lots of questions to be answered and exciting times if this can get some footing.

SFU has NCAA rules to work around and wouldn't be putting a team in this or any league outside of their regular season. That's why you don't see NCAA teams in leagues like PDL etc... NCAA has some really stupid rules, no doubt!

One rule that may changing in the near future if US Soccer gets their way is the length of the NCAA season. They want it to extend past the winter, have a winter break and be spread out with a "March Madness" some time in the mid-late spring. If so, that may effect this league and L1O as players would have a tough time playing both for that length of time. PDL might get a pass as they have done an outstanding job of media relations showcasing it as the future of MLS players.
 
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djones

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Here is a summary I nicked from somewhere else in regards to the league. I'm just too lazy to not plagiarize. Thanks to whoever wrote this up...

...Financial requirements are high because they don't want it to be a "flash-in-pan, one-off season." They're looking for consistency & continuity with a 3-year commitment period.

With the CanPL coming along, BC was missing a key step in the development pathway. BCRT3 will sit below Whitecaps' USL-side and help bridge the gap. This will provide some key players to CanPL down the line.

There were 2 main reasons for the 3-month season, which was summed up as "Let's not run before we can walk." The league is "new territory" and experimental in nature. They are open to extending the season if it shows consistency. Additionally, they were concerned about the potential player pool and identified CIS & NCAA players returning to BC for the summer as the likely pool.

In regards to the D3-Interprovincial Cup: That's a connection to be explored "eventually."

In regards to women's sides: Something to consider one-day. "Let's not run before we can walk."
 

utah

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I remember reading somewhere before that you could bet on Ontario League games?
They must be part of the sports bet for the Lottery so I wonder if the league gets some money from that?
 

djones

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I remember reading somewhere before that you could bet on Ontario League games?
They must be part of the sports bet for the Lottery so I wonder if the league gets some money from that?

There is LO1 and the old CSL in Ontario. The CSL is the one that has the fixing scandals and is the one that has all the betting.
 

Regs

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Not really surprising.

Maybe that they even bothered to issue a press release is the only surprising element here.
 

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