Div 3 [VMSL Div 3] Predictions, Results & Banter 2017/2018

[RickG]

Bowen 0, Strathcona 0
Ugly, physical game, where our two main central mids weren't able to come and we had to improvise at the last minute, and gave up a LOT of possession as a result. Still, we man marked their key playmaker and he got frustrated very quickly. Their guy and our guy were doing a lot of pushing and shoving throughout, and our player got a yellow for pushing after the whistle around the 10 minute mark. At 30 minutes they both got yellows and we had to go down to 10 guys. Strathcona were pretty much all over us after that for much of the game.
Second half we settled down a bit and started to generate a few attacks but the game kept getting chippier and chippier. Their playmaker got his second yellow and was sent off with about 10 minutes to go. As the game ended they seemed really pissed with the draw because of the huge advantage it gives Westside in the title race.
Honestly, for the most part these guys are a complete bag of dicks. For example their keeper overtly cleated one of our players near the end of the match when the ref wasn't looking. They are a solid team technically and don't need to play this way, so I'm not sure what the aggro is all about. Having said that, while they are more physical and defend better than Westside, I now think they are not as fast or as dangerous overall. And Westside is successful without having to be jerks about it.
So Trece, fyi their key playmaker (6) is suspended for your game, which should help. They are strong overall but that will weaken them a bit . Go Celtic!

 

[trece verde]

LOL - thanks for softening them up for us. Go Boners! (still can't say that with a straight face, though...)

 

[Canucks4Ever]

West Coast Saints can tie up the Div. 3B title with a win this weekend over Campo B. In 3A Westside burned their cushion at the top with a 2-0 loss to Lobbans last weekend and now sit on 39 points, just one above second place Strathcona who moved to 38 after a 4-0 against VAFC. If Lobbans were to win their games in hand, they too would sit on 38 points and they will play Strathcona this Friday while Westside sit idle on their bye week. You have to think the loser of that one will likely be out of promotion contention with so few games remaining.

Greencaps B took control of 3C with a massive 3-2 win over promotion rivals Richmond Olympics. They can move within one win of promotion with a win this week over a North Delta team who are winless in four and have fallen off the map after once being right in the promotion race. Interestingly, Greencaps won their first game of the season over White Eagles B via forfeit due to the Burnaby outfit's use of an ineligible player. Presumably the score line in the match was either a draw or a win for White Eagles and instead Greencaps were credited with the win and White Eagles were docked an additional three points. If White Eagles had won that game fair and square, both them and Greencaps would be tied on 39 points and battling it out over these last few games. And who says games in September don't matter?

 

[Soccer Mom]

In 3A, statement win for Strathcona over Lobbans. The loss pretty much puts Lobbans outside of the promotion race. Westside can't afford anything less than 3 wins from their remaining 3 matches if they want to keep the pressure on Strathcona.

Was nice to finally get a W after a tough streak against the top 3 teams over the past 4 matches for us in South Delta. Also got a couple players back which helped the cause in the 3-0 win over Celtic. Celtic was decent but didn't produce much. They had a decent opportunity in the first half that would've tied it up at 1's. No real danger after that. Celtic completely lost their composure in the final 5 minutes after a bad tackle from behind on our striker who was in clean on a breakaway. Straight red shown, no question there. Their bench completely lost it somehow believing only a yellow was warranted, ref had heard enough and flashed the red to one of their vocal guys on the bench, well earned.

Tough cup match against Siaron up next. I expect a close game, perhaps we'll see some PKs. Anyone have intel?

 

[trece verde]

Soccer Mom, I wasn't there due to a commitment with our masters' team, so anything I know is secondhand, but what I was told was that there were some pretty atrocious refereeing decisions made during the game, and that was allegedly the last straw that set our coach off after the red shown our centre back. I know our numbers were short due to too many guys who don't understand the link between geography and needing to travel to get to away games, so I can understand the anemic attack. Too bad for us.

Siaron were a masters' team that got younger and reinvented themselves. They have had relatively good results over the season. Sorry, that's all I have.

 

[Soccer Mom]

Soccer Mom, I wasn't there due to a commitment with our masters' team, so anything I know is secondhand, but what I was told was that there were some pretty atrocious refereeing decisions made during the game, and that was allegedly the last straw that set our coach off after the red shown our centre back.

There were some questionable calls/no calls for sure. But it went both ways. We were upset about some things we thought were wrong as well, as is typical in any match - and typically more so when you're on the losing end of a match. You didn't lose because of the ref, we were already up 2-0 and dominating. To say 'that was the last straw' when the call was clearly the correct one, I think speaks to your teams attitude toward the referee in general that night. It was your backline that got beat and your centre back had to haul our striker down from behind who was in on a clear breakaway, denying an obvious goal scoring opportunity. It's in the law book, it's a straight red. Our striker finished with a hat trick by the way.

Every time you guys got touched, or were tackled there were Athletic FC players calling at the ref trying to draw a free kick. I recall a similar attitude when we played you at Andy Livingston. It was one of the worst displays of sportsmanship I've seen all season to be honest. I told that to your striker near the end of the game and all he could do was smile at me in agreement. Anyways, good luck the rest of the way and cheers for the intel on Siaron.

 

[Farquea]

We wrapped up Div 3C last night with a win meaning the race is now on between Richmond and Celts to finish 2nd and hopefully nick the 2nd best runner up spot and promotion. A great season for us but also by all the teams in 3C, we were made to work each game and pushed all the way by the teams behind us.

 

[lego3]

We wrapped up Div 3C last night with a win meaning the race is now on between Richmond and Celts to finish 2nd and hopefully nick the 2nd best runner up spot and promotion. A great season for us but also by all the teams in 3C, we were made to work each game and pushed all the way by the teams behind us.

Congrats sir!!

 

[Canucks4Ever]

Indeed congratulations to Greencaps B, from 3C, who are the first team to confirm their promotion to Division 2. West Coast Saints can join them as they will be champions of 3B if they are able to pick up just one more point from either of their two remaining games, or if GFC Lions drop a point anywhere along the way. Worst case scenario, Saints are guaranteed at least a playoff to go up if they lose out and GFC win out. In 3A it is looking like it will go right down to the wire as Westside jumped back to the top of the pile, beating America 4-2 this weekend in their game in hand over Strathcona who were occupied in the cup.

With the games dwindling down we are now finally able to get a lay of the land as it pertains to the race for the bonus promotion spot. It is essentially a 3 team race between the Westside/Strathcona runner up, Richmond Olympics and West Coast Celts; though the West Coast Saints/GFC Lions runner up and Burnaby Selects White Eagles B are still mathematically alive.

Because not all the divisions will play the same number of games, due to Akal's dropping out of 3B, the tie breaker is set to be Points Per Game. However, this would only come into play for the GFC/West Coast Saints runner up. The maximum number of points they could earn would be 40 from 19 games, for a PPG of 2.11. If you don't like math though, don't worry, because as long as one of the teams in the other two groups gets to 43 points, everything will be straight forward. 43 points from 20 games is a PPG of 2.15, and, with three teams already on 41 points, chances are at least one of them will win another game. Therefore, likely, we can just look for the second place team with the highest point total!

The contenders are:

Strathcona* - 3A - 41pts - 2GR
Richmond - 3C - 41pts - 2GR
West Coast Celts - 3C - 41pts - 2GR
Burnaby Selects - 3C - 37pts - 2GR

*Still a chance to win 3A title

 

[RickG]

Strathcona are much stronger physically than Westside, and defend better as a team, although, I'll reiterate my earlier comment that Westside's attack was slightly more effective than Strathcona's when we have faced them. Unless they completely choke, Westside should be able to hang on and win the division, but, even if so, I won't be surprised to see Strathcona win the second place play down and move up too. Overall, they are the better balanced team (even if I think they have too many jerks in the side).

As for Bowen, we lost a close one to Bombastic B, 0-1 a few weeks back. None of our regular starters showed up, and we had to scramble to scrape together a team of guys who haven't played much this year. It ended up as a good game for those guys, who got in a full 90, kept it close, and had a few decent chances, but a revitalized Bombastic side were a bit too much on the day.

Next match, round one of the Div. 2 Cup, with many of our regulars back and even a couple of subs, was a 3-1 Cup win over Vancity. Despite the win it was a sloppy game for Boner's and Vancity deserve credit for pushing hard and playing a clean but spirited match.

This past Saturday we were able to field a team with almost all of our best players, to face a really determined, well coached, and well organized Lobbans side, fresh off an impressive cup win over a Div. 2 side.

With only 11 guys, again, we abandoned pressing in the first half, sitting back, trying to absorb the Lobbans pressure and then hit them on the counter. It worked better than we could have imagined and the island lads scored 3 unanswered goals. We had a little luck, but it was also the team's most determined and balanced effort this season. Hopefully we can build on the momentum for the upcoming cup game against Royal City,

 

[Canucks4Ever]

Westside wrapped up the Div. 3A this weekend along with the third promotion place. Strathcona from 3A and Richmond from 3C are level on 47 and done for the season. Presumably they will playoff for the extra vacant Division 2 spot; though they will need to wait until West Coast Celts from 3C play their final game against league winners Greencaps B. If West Coast win then they too will be on 47 points and it would need to be a three team playoff.

However, this is where it gets VERY murky. Under the VMSL Rules and Regulations 6.3, to fill a vacancy the protocol calls for the team with the next highest points total (or points per page if the teams did not play the same number of games - a situation we are fortunately avoiding in this case), regardless of section/group, shall be promoted. It then says, if two or more teams are tied that goal difference will be used to determine who fills the vacancy. However, I believe this rule was written with a view to filling vacancies that arise in the offseason when players and teams have dissolved for the year and not ones that have been on record for the entire season. We all know that the VMSL's preferred tie-breaking is a playoff, so it would stand to reason that this is how they will settle this vacancy. Furthermore, in this instance, Strathcona and Richmond both have the SAME goal difference of +45 and the Rules and Regulations make no allowance for this situation. It would seem then that a playoff is most fitting if it is to be just these two teams.

Now, if West Coast win their remaining fixture, we really go down the rabbit hole. I believe a rule was enacted after Campo were promoted to fill a vacancy in Division 1 that if the teams were in the same group, head to head record would be used to determine the higher finishing team. West Coast and Richmond were in the same group and split the season series, each winning once. So where does that leave us? Well, we're off the edge of the map. If the next tiebreaker is head to head goal difference. West Coast have the edge on aggregate 7-2. That would then put them in the position of finishing "ahead" of Richmond, but then, per Rule 6.3, Strathcona, with a better overall goal difference of +45 to West Coast's +39 (plus whatever they beat Greencaps by in this scenario which figures to be less than 6) the East Van side would therefore be in a position to be promoted without a playoff. If the next tiebreaker when team's head to head records are even is overall goal difference then Richmond finishes "ahead" of West Coast and we are back to seemingly a certainly playoff between them and Strathcona. Or the league totally goes rogue and makes it a three team playoff which, while not provided for in the rules, certainly seems the most fair way to resolve this.

 

[RickG]

Final Bowen league game today, Boners versus Celtic at Andy Livingston. We had 10 they had 11 but to get that they had to recruit an over 35 player who looked like he was, like, 50. With nothing at stake for either team, the match felt a lot more like a Sunday pick up game than a league game. Plus, I moved guys around into unfamiliar positions in the fun spirit of the day. Final score was 4-1 Bowen, but I'm sure the Celtic team was a patchwork, and their forwards, lucky for us, couldn't hit the broad side of a barn door today.

We'll field a team this summer in the NSSL, but a lot of our guys are moving off island and it won't be clear until early June if we'll be able to field a team for next year's VMSL season. It has been a great five years in the league and I hope we can pull off another season, but, nothing is clear about next year at this point. Cheers, and best to all!!

 

[Gurps]

We'll field a team this summer in the NSSL, but a lot of our guys are moving off island and it won't be clear until early June if we'll be able to field a team for next year's VMSL season. It has been a great five years in the league and I hope we can pull off another season, but, nothing is clear about next year at this point. Cheers, and best to all!!

I hope you guys do field a Team @RickG . I imagine it has been tough with the travel and getting guys to commit but you guys are a asset to the league.

 

[machel]

I concur, hope you guys can stay in the league. Always nice reading the game reports and such. Cheers

 

[Canucks4Ever]

Hearing from sources that the league will settle the matter of Sea to Sky's vacant Div. 2 spot with a 3 team playoff between all the second place finishers. That somehow resurrects GFC from 3B and their chances to be promoted along with Strathcona from 3A. West Coast Celts did indeed throw a wrench into things by beating Greencaps in their final game which puts them level with Richmond in 3C. Not sure how the league is going to sort that out. Perhaps a pre-playoff, playoff between those two or maybe they will both be entered into the promotion playoff.

 

[dezza]

@Canucks4Ever looks like the playoff play-in match between Richmond + Celts is scheduled, as well as the first of the round robins including GFC.

No idea, how this was determined to be the way to decide things, as there's absolutely nothing in the VMSL Rules that would lead GFC being involved. The round robin should be between the 3 teams on 47 pts!

 

[lego3]

No idea, how this was determined to be the way to decide things, as there's absolutely nothing in the VMSL Rules that would lead GFC being involved. The round robin should be between the 3 teams on 47 pts!

I agree with you it should be between the teams who are on the 47 points. If I was Richmond or West Coast I would be pissed to find out about playoff game to get into round robin. Who made this decision?

 

[club_i_champ]

The Richmond lads are not pleased

 

[big gk]

how does the cat system work in the playoffs? how many games have you played in total this year CIC? 30 plus for your club? good for you old man

 

[Canucks4Ever]

Yes, bizarre decision by the league and I look forward to them trying to explain their way out of this one. Best explanation that I was able to source out was that this was a promotion spot and not a "vacancy" therefore Rule 6.3 is not in effect. I am told rule 6.3 vacancies refer to when teams do not return to the league and the VMSL receives this notice in August, etc. (ie Surrey Utd.), and must fill the spot when no playoffs can take place. The language in the rules and regs really needs to be cleaned up to define this as we continue to have these unexpected vacancies, etc., and the league seemingly just changes the rules every time. They are not necessarily wrong in determining the best way to fill these spots, though I am sure there are several opinions, but it is a bit mickey mouse when you keep appearing to make it up as you go along. As Sea to Sky were expelled from the league without ever having played a game their spot is being looked at as an extra promotion spot that ALL second place teams get to playoff for the chance to claim. Richmond and West Coast tied for second place in 3C and thus, like any other tiebreaker in the VMSL, must playoff to determine who finishes in second and then gets a chance to enter the promotion playoff. I guess the reasoning is fair, but, because there is not an iron clad rule that all the teams knew about in advance, I think it is only fair for a team like Richmond or West Coast to have a moan.

The real issue, if you ask me, is that this is completely different than how the league handled the Division 1 vacancy when Akal was expelled after never playing a game last season. The league still counted Akal as a relegated team and did not promote an extra Division 2 team, despite the boisterous objections of a certain North Vancouver based team... Anyway, if the same rules had been applied in this case then VUFC would be safe and Royal City would be playing off against Euro with only the usual three teams coming up from Division 3. I just think the league needs to clean up the language in the rules so that everyone knows what is happening from the start and it is a transparent process without all this speculating.

As for the CAT system, historically it has always been in effect for playoffs, however, as Div. 3 is at the bottom of the pyramid, there is not a team that players could be called up from. None of the four playoff teams have a U21 team or any affiliated Masters teams that I am aware of, so it will only be players signed to those squads taking part.