BCPL- BC Premier League: Proposal

[ghouse]

Wow.

Ghouse, I don’t think anyone can knock your enthusiasm. Some of it may be a bit on the delusional side, but in principle, I do agree with:

~The concept of uniting the best teams from across the Lower Mainland and the Island- in one Premier division- is long overdue.
~The opportunity is NOW. I agree that piggybacking on the elevated interest the Whitecap’s expansion into MLS is key.

As to your comparisons to Wakeboarding…though I respect the promotional success of those events, you can’t compare that to the BCPL. You will be targeting completely different markets, and you have a full schedule slate to deal with. When you can showcase an extreme sport or event in a great venue, in a one-weekend shot, you leave yourself w/ the big cash-in opportunity.

Soccer will never appeal to the extreme sports crowd. Not going to happen, ever. Soccer does and should appeal to the casual fan, if packaged properly.

Also, and this is as obvious as I can think…so long as this or any of the three leagues continues to play through the winter, you simply won’t get the families out. It’s a non starter. I would think that part of the BCPL growth strategy would be a move to a summer callendar.

But, that is- for now- an irrelevant point. One step at a time, and the first should be the establishment of the league.

I’ve learned a lot in the last 12 hours or so about where and how this whole thing went sideways, and I have to agree w/ a whole lot that has been written: the VMSL teams and stakeholders have been left out of the process. It isn’t the money. As Millar has pointed out, there are some pretty experienced football people on that side of the fence with some pretty strong attributes they can bring to the table; some who may fundamentally disagree, some who will always disagree w/ the concept, no matter what, but others who are open to the concept, so long as they can contribute. At the end of the day, it comes down to involving your membership in the process. I think that the FVSL teams have felt fairly involved and informed. Even guys like me- creaky old Masters who have no real stake in this- have been well informed. Not just officially, but through the grapevine, and it has all been fairly consistent and transparent.

Now we have- as Millar put it- back-door dealing and flip-flopping on the VMSL. You guys are scrambling, and rightfully so. The common thread is that you are all passionate about the issue- one way or another. Passion leads to action. Too bad it took you all 8 months to get together on it. And, I guess for this cluster****, you need to look at your leadership, and ask serious questions.

Mr. Azzi’s legacy for this league should be obvious to everyone: he stepped up and took leadership at a time that the league should have otherwise collapsed. It was when, 1997 when the bank account was cleared out- wasn’t it? In a time when the league needed strong leadership, he stepped up and provided it. Say what you will about it being a dictatorship; maybe the league needed a dictator at that time. Maybe I’m being a bit over-the-top (I’m sure Captain will tell me so), but for all that perhaps you guys can all thank the man before he hands in his resignation. And, quite honestly, it appears that his resignation may indeed be what is required to move forward on this, one way or another. I know I’ve felt that a change in leadership was overdue for the past few seasons. Your meeting Sunday (it is still unclear weather if it was an official league meeting w/ minutes being taken, or simply a casual Q&A get-together- in which case all your votes may be in question as to the official legality anyhow) was, if nothing else, a massive show of non-confidence.

Also, from my understanding, the objection coming from the Island isn’t exactly the teams themselves not wanting involvement, but more like some of the older players on those teams. That is a big difference from the Island wanting out. I can definitely see some of the older players not wanting involvement, for family or career reasons. But that is a far cry from the actual VISL itself not being in support of the BCPL.

I agree w/ Guinness…you guys need to collectively take control of your league if you don’t like the way it is currently being led. I would just say that in doing so, show Mr. Azzi his due respect as you show him the door. Then, everyone take a breath, and get back to the drawing board w/ an open forum style line of communication. Take another year if you need to dial in the fine points, and go from there. My opinion, anyhow.

I wasnt compareing Wakeboarding and soccer. I was just giveing a whats been done before.
Obviously we are talking way smaller numbers over longer periods of time.
And yes moveing to summer would need to take place to make this a bigger success.
All in the plan that Azzi didnt explain to his group.

 

[ghouse]

GHouse:

With your "promoter" background and all of that...

Did you organise and "promoted" a long weekend tournament in the summer a couples of years back? At Burnaby Lake?

If that was a success why did you quit doing it?

Even though you tried by accomodating the stronger teams in one side and the weaker teams in the other side (here you included your team which according to you have played games against the best in BC. ei. 3-3 Surrey, beat Croatia, etc.) so could get to the finals and get the $10,000

Just refreshing my memory.

Yours truly,

PAC2010

The tournament was never a permanent thing . It was just to send a team back east to the Open Canada Cup to show the CSA that the CSL could get a rep from out West so thier tournament was a national open championship so they would qualify under CONCACAF rules to compete in the CONCACAF champions league. It worked and the next year the CSA formed the Nutralite Championship. the CSL is still fighting to get a team put in. Thats another CSA blunder and thread.

ACBC was in div2 back then

 

[Dude]

Dude, that is way easier said than done. Frankly, youth clubs just don't give a sh!t about Senior men's soccer, and why would they?

Trying asking Sandman about how well partnering ICST with SYS Pegasus worked out for them getting better field access...

Dezza...understood. That said, it's being done all over the Valley with a fairly high degree of success. Growing pains, set-backs, and all.

Again- who's issue is it? The league's or the club's?

 

[Dude]

I wasnt compareing Wakeboarding and soccer. I was just giveing a whats been done before.
Obviously we are talking way smaller numbers over longer periods of time.
And yes moveing to summer would need to take place to make this a bigger success.
All in the plan that Azzi didnt explain to his group.

Fair enough, but the point being you've gone on and on about attracting sponsors (no matter how you choose to spell it). In your CV overview, you failed to point out the shortcomings of the BCPL, from a promotions standpoint. There are serious flaws and shortcomings, the two biggest being winter season and lack of proper facilities to accommodate a crowd.

Tell me this Ghouse...you're an experienced promoter. What haven't you purchased the promotional rights to the BCPL? In exchange for a nominal fee, you have exclusive right to promote as you see fit. This way, the clubs would have nothing to bitch about…money and expenses covered, all is good.

Is it because there isn't much to sell? Is it because you’d lose your shirt, and you know it? Its one thing to sell Wakefest or Crankworks to sponsors…this is a much more difficult sell, and you know it.

Just saying…let's be realistic here, and compare this venture fairly. It is comparable to the Senior A Lacrosse league, at best. Even at this, there are still facility shortcomings.

 

[ghouse]

I'm an organizer for Croatia. I don't know the other VMSL clubs very well but my take is that the majority of clubs are being run by 2-4 guys who are already stretched-thin to operate a team week-to-week. On top of the usual VMSL demands for the organizers, the new league will add more work in the form of increased fundraising, more player recruitment, and overall more overhead. The upside is negligible. Is 'better soccer in Canada' really a priority for the organizers when just fielding a competitive team next season requires a minor miracle?

Most VMSL clubs don't have the fundamental pieces to be ready for a next step. Specifically, they lack community support and a reliable source of talent. The first priority of the VMSL should be to help clubs solve those core problems. They don't need a new league. The clubs need facilities for training, resources/expertise to reach out to their communities, and basic facilities to accomodate their supporters when they do come to a game.

The comparison to the BCHL is great because the contrast is obvious. BCHL clubs commit many resources into community awareness which makes them a viable channel to potential customers for their sponsors. They also have arenas that provide a fantastic atmosphere for supporters and families. How do you compare that to standing on the sidelines in the mud at Hastings Bowl?

Thanks for reading.

I respect everything Croatia has done in the past..but its hard for me to swallow your haveing a hard time when your the only team that owns thier own training field and has the biggest and best BBQ fundraisers at that facilty. I have been a few times and its a cash cow compaired to the poker fundraisers we hold. I do agree the hastings bowl is no place for teams to play who are trying to charge admission. I also paid $10 twice to watch Croatia/Serbia games. Not a huge money maker but definately made a few bucks to pay for something.
That Idea of moveing those games to a better facility is exactly what im talking about. Great Idea. It shows the amount of support you guys already have in the soccer community.
Now as for trying to stay competititve year after year...come on every team has the exact same problem..Thats soccer my friend.
When your vets move on,you must replace them and if your not well organized at the top and are not prepaired to lose the older great players and you havent been working in advance to find the next best thing...tough luck. Thats soccer everywhere in the world.
As for resourses...they will never come until we are in the public eye first.

 

[ghouse]

Fair enough, but the point being you've gone on and on about attracting sponsors (no matter how you choose to spell it). In your CV overview, you failed to point out the shortcomings of the BCPL, from a promotions standpoint. There are serious flaws and shortcomings, the two biggest being winter season and lack of proper facilities to accommodate a crowd.

Tell me this Ghouse...you're an experienced promoter. What haven't you purchased the promotional rights to the BCPL? In exchange for a nominal fee, you have exclusive right to promote as you see fit. This way, the clubs would have nothing to bitch about…money and expenses covered, all is good.

Is it because there isn't much to sell? Is it because you’d lose your shirt, and you know it? Its one thing to sell Wakefest or Crankworks to sponsors…this is a much more difficult sell, and you know it.

Just saying…let's be realistic here, and compare this venture fairly. It is comparable to the Senior A Lacrosse league, at best. Even at this, there are still facility shortcomings.

I agree with you 100%.
Summer season was in talks at the BCPL level
All double header games were to be played at ,what we have as the best mini stadiums. Also talked at the BCPL meetings.
Again things that could be put forth as we moved forward.
The league would have to address these items to make the league a success.
A huge undertakeing to sell to sponsors...Thats why it must be done NOW while the MLS wave is rolling. Sponsors will be into soccer for this short period of time. The buzz will be out there. If there was any time to approach sponsors its at this time...Not after the buzz is over. We need to approach these people while its the thing to do...That is just my point

 

[knvb]

...

 

[ghouse]

Guys I understand why the VMSL teams are pissed.
I get it.
But one thing Azzi ,Thomas and Kjeld Brodsgaard (Island) got was the fact that moveing forward NOW is crucial.
FVSL and the Island did it correctly..the VMSL did not..But it was done the same way he has done everything in the past . And no one asked or stood up before. I dont think he was being a dictator, I think he was just doing what he has always done and never was questioned before. His intentions were good. I believe he was just doing what he thought was best. And as I said before ,because he new we needed to do this fast so not to miss out on the timeing of whats about to come. He moved forward.
He saved the league before and I think he could see the future was now to move the league to the next level.
Yes done wrong...But not to be sneeky..Just as how he does things. With the best interest at heart.
Never the less what is done is done.
And a shame...

 

[Polska]

Hey Knvb ...

This is the best thread i've seen on TTP in quite some time...

Stay out of it..

go be a hero else where

Please and thank you

 

[knvb]

right, gotcha, thanks. You do know the first 8 pages read just like the last 8, right, fcukwit?

I'll get my coat.

 

[number10hamburgler]

Honestly, it sounds like the people organizing the BCPL should have a couple of emergency meetings/sessions and information meetings with the top clubs to clarify and answer some questions. Cause it sounds like there is a bit of uncertainty floating around.

After talking with some players from clubs/teams in all leagues, it does sound like money is an issue for many clubs. Whether they like to openly admit it or not. For example, some Island teams, it costs around $10,000-$15,000 per season for them just in their own league, mostly due to travelling costs and so on. But add the BCPL cities in the mix for travelling, and that number skyrockets. And some teams are just unprepared and/or unwilling to take that step. Whether it's financially or just by the way things are, they rather travel within their district or city, have a beer after the game, and not have to worry about making the late ferry back.

I think at these meetings their should be people who give ballpark numbers how much the expenses are going to cost being a team in the league, are their any sponsors what will they do, and also give guidelines or pointers to teams how to raise money, whether it's through sponsorship deals, community events, so on and so on.

The guys who really want to get this league secured for next year, should really be pulling out the stops in educating and explaining to teams the how,when,where's and so on. Have as many meetings til everyone who needs to be on board is on board. The onus is on them. Cause clubs with financial troubles or don't feel that there's enough information will be leaning toward "no", regardless if the BCPL is an awesome thing and big step in BC soccer.

Regardless, this league will go through eventually, every major sport in BC has something similar to the BC Premier League, whether it's Baseball or Hockey and so on. It's time soccer has it too. The key question is when. And it seems like now is the best time for it. There definitely is a window of opportunity here, with the Whitecaps and MLS coming.

 

[Polska]

right, gotcha, thanks. You do know the first 8 pages read just like the last 8, right, fcukwit?

I'll get my coat.

ya u get your coat and head straight to the bat cave robin... report me to batman ya wank

 

[Millar]

GHouse, like I said, I do not doubt your enthusiasm, nor your will and wish to see soccer improve and succeed. And I don't think you should read into which way I lean as far as moving forward.

I do, however, disagree with one thing you are saying. Moving ahead without a plan on paper that is TOTALLY agreed on by all involved, that is organized, covers all scenarios, has escape routes if things begin to fizzle, is a recipe for disaster, no matter how enthusiastic people are.

I know you want things to improve, however if this is rushed and all the details aren't ironed out, and the league subsequently fails, which is a concern, all 3 existing leagues and the participating clubs are in a mess, and soccer will have regressed substantially farther back.

That is where I disagree with you. If you want this league to be successful, give it the best chance possible to succeed. Flying by the seat of our pants, and coming up with solutions along the way isn't the answer in my opinion.

 

[Sir M]

The biggest issue is quality of opposition, and the fact that the VMSL had a very bad deal with this model. Why would top VMSL clubs want to go in a league with inferior opposition?

I find it very telling that people from teams who cannot realistically compete with the big 6 or 7 in the VMSL when it matters are the ones who are big proponents of this league, some quite desperately.

In my view, it is at this point not about the altruism of the "good of the game", and to masquerade that as such is insulting. It is more about people wanting to create a process whereby they can get into the league with the strongest level of competetion instead of by the traditional method(s). For now, I say they earn it on the pitch.

Bottom line is, the best teams will go to the best league. The current BCPL proposal is a far cry from that.

Sir M.

 

[Millar]

One other thing,

I don't believe that timing with MLS is relevant for sponsors. Having a very good game plan is what is important. If the MLS is successful here, soccer is going to be popular anyway. Besides, with the Olympics, and most importantly the economy in the shitter, sponsors aren't exactly jumping up and down anyway looking to throw amateur sport money anyway.

Thanks a lot Regs, I enjoyed always being a lurker. Now I feel like I'm a meth addict, needing to get my next hit. This damn site is screwing with my day.

 

[Regs]

Thriller,

Remember back when you were 11 and you kicked me in the shin?

Revenge is sweet and now my life is complete.

 

[Millar]

I'm sure you're taking the piss right now, but if you're not, and you do remember something like that, I do not believe your life is complete. I believe your life is in dire need of a new approach! LOL

 

[Polska]

Can somebody fill me in here.. What is the Incentive for Winning the BCPL?

Would money not change a few minds from the VMSL side?

 

[Millar]

Polska, I would hope money as an incentive would not change anyone's mind. After all, this proposed league is supposed to be for the betterment of soccer isn't it?

 

[Regs]

'm sure you're taking the piss right now, but if you're not, and you do remember something like that, I do not believe your life is complete. I believe your life is in dire need of a new approach! LOL

I don't understand?



One thing that I kinda see happening is Azzi being thrown under the bus here a bit. Sure it appears that he made some poor decisions in not making 100% sure that everyone was on the same page and informed, but I don't think that should mask that it also appears that there is no substantial plan in place that can be acted upon for the super league to attain its stated goals.