Whitecaps vs San Jose 20110512

[Regs]

1-1 final.

Thank fcuk I passed up on making the trek out to Empire for this one.

Why did Koffe not play?

Why was Hassli taken off and not Camilo? Hassli was the ONLY Cap in the first half who could pass a fcuking ball and did well with what he had to work with - sure he had a spell for about 10 minutes in the second where he lost possession but seriously?

Is Thiebert nursing an injury or something?

The Cap's centrebacks are woeful. They drop too far back, they are rarely tight to their man and to be honest, I think they are shite in the air (especially Akoul!) and I have no idea why Cmac and Nash think they are so good. Demerit will help greatly of course but somehow I'm sure TT will find a way to fcuk it up - maybe by pairing him with Wagner or Knight in the middle

This team sorely needs a midfield general and an updated playing philosophy.

Until that happens, I don't see myself using my tickets when it's pissing down rain.

 

[geezer]

The question should be why is TT instituting a rotation when clearly he has to play his best 11 just to get a draw. Demerit's communication is the only thing that saved them in the end, as well as his ability to get to the ball agreesively before it bounces. I mean no wonder we leak goals when we are that passive, as a defender there is no excuse for putting yourself under pressure by letting the thing bounce.

 

[Gloucester_Boy]

Yeah, still digesting that one. 1-1 draw feels a lot better than a 1-0 loss but last minute ties against shite teams at home are wearing a bit thin.

Regs, apparently Hassli has a hamstring issue and that's why TT took him off (and not Camillo, who was a total non-factor). I just about lost it when they made that sub but makes a bit more sense considering Hassli had a tweak. Healthy, or even unhealthy, he would have buried those chances that fell to Salgado and Camillo on the left side of the box. He's listed as doubtful for Saturday, which is not good.

Teibert, no idea on that one. I don't know what this kid has to do to get a full game but watching Chuimiento drift around where the striker should be and full-backs pumping balls up to Camillo (who is surrounded by giants) as a result, must have been a tad frustrating. Starting to sound like a broken record on this one but perhaps TT can show some video of Salinas playing the wide position properly and go from there.

Koffie, same deal. He had one sub-par game last weekend but everyone had a shocker in that one, plus he's been a beast in every game before that. Can only assume that TT wanted to rest him but, as Geezer noted, why are we playing a rotation when we have a good chance to get a result against a brutal team at home.

Whinging about the line-up aside, I actually saw some positive signs out there. I thought they moved the ball better through the backline and the midfield better than we've seen in a while, at least in the first half (Dunfield nightmare notwithstanding). Brovsky was a million times better than in his first few appearances IMHO. DeMerit back is a huge boost. You could see it and feel it, even before the goal.

Put Koffie in there, give Teibert 90 minutes and get Chuimiento somewhere other than in a wide position, and I think we can turn this around.

 

[johnnybluenose]

I saw just bits and pieces of the match before I got home to watch the last half hour.

On the centre backs: Demerit is still recovering, and I suppose that's why he only came on for the last 15 or so, he is a different class from the others on that backline, save Rochat. Janicki is knackered for pace and footspeed, which is likely why he gives up so much gap. Akloul I think is a good player, just needs a bit more time to settle in, I think he is going to make an excellent partner for Demerit once those two settle in together. (excellent by MLS Standards ) and I'd disagree Regs, last night aside (i didn't see enough of the game) but Akloul seems to win a LOT of 50/50 balls and is pretty good in the air.

We still have 1 intl spot/1 roster spot IIRC, and I REALLY think that Soehn has got to have a DP or higher calibre Central Midfielder lined up to come once the European transfer window opens in July. You'd have to think so anyways. Right now they really have 5 guys to play that position in Dunfield, Koffie, Morfaw (who hasn't even kicked an MLS ball yet due to injury and long road back) Brovsky (shudder) and Thorrington (What's his deal!?) And that just isn't good enough. Teams leading their respective divisions have MUCH better players in the Engine Room.

I'm really starting to question everything TT does, from picking his 18, his formation, etc etc etc.

Again, I really want to see Cannon between the pipes instead of Nolly. Dunfield needs to be a rotation player, he can't play as poor as this and continue to be handed 90 minutes a game, he hasn't played a solid full 90 yet, the TFC game aside perhaps, and I REALLY feel that big Eric should be a lone wolf up front with Chiumiento behind him in a free role, trequartista if you will. Flat 4 midfield behind them and flat four behind that, which should almost always be Rochat-Demerit-Akloul/Boxall-Salinas

Teibert is due to have a poor showing here and there, he is 17/18 years old...and pint sized.

Looking at our results/schedule to date vs that of the timbers really makes me wonder just what to expect for the rest of the year.

As a spectator, I haven't seen them thoroughly outplayed/embarrassed save for the Houston game. Not to give TT and the Caps a free pass on any criticism, but considering the injury woes, players adjusting to MLS etc- I'd say they've been just ok, they've given points away they had no business giving away and stolen a draw here and there they had no business stealing.

For me: I'd rather what we've had so far which is tight games with the lose, draw, draw, lose, etc then win loss loss loss win loss loss etc..

My $0.02 worth.

 

[dezza]

JBN, Vagenas is the thirtieth and final member of the Vancouver Whitecaps roster.

Also, keep in mind that it takes 3 ties to equal 1 win in the standings.

This team desperately NEEDS to win some games.

 

[johnnybluenose]

You are correct, and I agree 100%, however I meant to say as a spectator watching games. I'd rather them be in every game and have it a draw or one goal affair then see them win 1 get beat many times in a row, then win one...

On Vagenas, you are also right, however I thought I'd read somewhere that when they released Randy Edwini-Bonsu another roster spot had opened up, essentially we had 29 and then he was released making way for vagenas... remember that Randy was an apprentice or something, so IIRC- they still have 1 roster spot open, and if not surely they can release a player like Blake Wagner, Kevin harmse, etc to make way for a new CM.

 

[cascadesoccer]

The only thing that is always 100% at empire is the atmosphere. On the SJ goal dunfield had 3 chances to clear it and everyone was a pin point pass right to an attacking SJ player. Kick the damn thing out of bounds if you have to and re set. If Camilo concentrated more on playing than getting free kicks we could make alot more progress moving forward. Salinas is a beast on the wing and having him healthy is a huge boost. I could be wrong but it seems our team is afraid to shoot from anywhere outside of the 18. We have any chance to shoot or cross and we knock it around to get that easy tap in. Hit the fcuking thing. Were lucky footy games arent 80 minutes or we would only have 3 points. And Regs if your seats are in the north or south like mine are (north) don't worry about the rain, cause I found a spot about 20 rows up in the stands right on the 18. Saved me $40 to boot!

 

[Dude]

Posted this in the salaries thread, and too lazy to come up w/ a new opinion, but it applies here...

After watching last night, Jeb Brovsky may be the most overpaid player in the MLS. I can think of 5 superior CM in the VMSL right now. I've been OK up till last night w/ Dunfield, but clearly he needs to be in the middle w/ an animal / ball winner like Koffie to be anywhere effective. He was shocking on the goal against.

How TT isn't starting Chuiminto in the middle is beyond me. The guy has more intelligence and awareness than anyone out there, is strong defending (when he does), and will open up attacking lanes. The service from the midfield was absolutely shocking last night.

I'd love to see Chui running the show, even in a 4-4-2 alignment. Put him in there with Koffie, who protects the ball and is a far better player all around than Brovsky. Dunfield, you need to sit and think about what you've done.

 

[johnnybluenose]

I'll take the bait and disagree with you Dude. Davide might be the worst player at covering any defensive responsibilities and I haven't seen him take/make many tackles... he is good at sitting in space to capitalize/force turnovers, but any donkey can do that, his ability to dribble and the fear he puts into the opposition defenders buys himself and others space because the defenders back off him a bit (as evidenced by his goal and the almost goal on the final whistle last night) is what makes him special.

I'd suggest Chiu in the middle of the park would expose our central midfield defensively...

When Davide did line up in the middle of the park last year next to Nash or Dunfield he was too far from goal and the opposition backline to create headaches for the opponent, and was exposed often defensively... that's a league lower and with even weaker teammates.

Brovsky is young, new draft pick... I'd actually say that Hassli @ 900K is their most overpaid player.

The CM's from the VMSL you speak of probably wouldn't go play for 42k per year (what Brovsky makes) (essentially the same as working 40 hours a week for $21.00 per hour)

 

[Dude]

Awesome.

This:

After watching last night, Jeb Brovsky may be the most overpaid player in the MLS.

was a bit tongue in cheek. I know you are new to TTP and all, but come on JBN. Yes, he only makes $42K, but I don't think he's worth $0K, and I can think of many a $0K earning VMSL player that'd be better...though you are probably right, $42K is not a living. That said, give me $42K as a 21 year old, I'd have followed the dream too.

RE: Chuimiento- Technically, when he wants to defend, he's sound. He doesn't dive in, but you don't want him diving in, you want him shutting down and limiting opportunities. Let the animal dive in and be the ball winner, you want Chui being the beneficiary of that, not the instrument.

Watch him very closely when he is intent on defending, he's as good as anyone. Besides, he's a better PLAYER, smarter tactically, and will attack. Give him the increased responsibility, and I bet he'd shine.

Hassli oozes class every time he touches the ball. The problem is that he's playing a game meant to have 10 teammates, but only 3 or 4 of them are actually up to his standard.

 

[Regs]

Hassli oozes class every time he touches the ball. The problem is that he's playing a game meant to have 10 teammates, but only 3 or 4 of them are actually up to his standard.

Spot on!!!

 

[termatofylakas]

Actually Dude I agree with you about Hassli. I think that him and Harris made a decent tandem but Harris is out for a while longer. Again Camilo is crap and overrated. The problem I find with him is he holds on to that ball too long or is too selfish a player. Plus like I stated earlier his team mates have a hard time reading his moves.

Change the formation is all I can think of right now. This 4-4-2 isn't working too well for the caps.

Try the 4-2-3-1 a.k.a 4-5-1 maybe.

A potential line-up I think that might work is:

Cannon

Salinas DeMerit Akloul/Boxall Rochat

Dunfield Koffie

Khalfan Chiumiento Teibert

Hassli


For me Dunfield plays better if he's not trying to go forward. You have a ball winner and a deep passer with those two, assuming he doesn't pass it to the other team like yesterday. Their main objective would be to just get the ball up to Davide. Another option is to put Leathers at RB and Salinas at LB and Rochat in for Dunfield. And when Harris gets healthy he can go on for Khalfan. Something is broken and needs fixing!

 

[johnnybluenose]

Dude, I did preface my post by saying "I'll take the bait" <-Smilie just for you. oops, I did it again...

You're bang on regarding Hassli. (You did know my calling him overpaid was a PT also...right?...)

I wonder what the big man thinks when he gets a ball into some space and starts getting closed down... does he look at the overlapping run by Wes Knight/Blake Wagner/etc and think to himself "Tabernac, I will just take zee ball and draw zee foul"

 

[Dude]

"Tabernac, I will just take zee ball and draw zee foul"

No, he does not. He may be French, but he's not a Quebequer.

(You did know my calling him overpaid was a PT also...right?...)

Sure JBN. OK.

 

[johnnybluenose]

French/Quebecois, you know what I'm getting at...

FYI: There are only 7 guys that make more than Hassli in the league, they are all over $1 Mill... DeGuzman, Marquez, Henry, Donovan, Becks, Angel & Castillo

In the stats columns as of today the only stat he ranks in the top 5 of is yelllow cards... Donovan, Beckham, Henry etc appear in other stats columns in the top 5, Beckham joins Hassli atop the cards list.

and in the MLS "Castrol Index" Hassli ranks 76th out of 373 Players that have played this year...

http://www.mlsplayers.org/files/May 1, 2011 Salary Information - By Club.pdf

If the Caps had an effective Central Midfielder Hassli would likely be higher and be contributing more, that all being said Demerit being out as long as he has been has been the most crippling to the team this year so far imho.

 

[Gloucester_Boy]

and in the MLS "Castrol Index" Hassli ranks 76th out of 373 Players that have played this year...

And based on the Castrol Index, Atiba Harris is the 5th best player in the league

Pretty good article (title says it all):

What is This Castrol Index Crap? - Eighty Six Forever

 

[johnnybluenose]

It's no different than the BBC player rater I'd assume.

Basically it takes certain metrics and rates players on a scale of 1-10... While Mr. 86 Forever might not like it, it has merit.

If you pass the ball successfully from say the middle to the forwards you get a point for, if you cough up a ball in your oppositions end it's not as bad as Dunfield turning the ball over to simply end up in your net...

Whether you like Harris or not, he's been incredibly effective for the Whitecaps in his minutes played imho...if only the refs would blow their whistles while he was getting whacked week in week out we might have a few more points: See Philly game and NE Revs game.

**Edit**
I should add: Stats are for losers

however, from what I've seen this year Henry has been the best player thus far this year, he has scored some sweet goals, his team is 4-1-3 with 11 Gf and 3 against, and he has played well in the 2 games of his I watched, easily the best player on the park...

and to be honest: Camilo HAS been more effective for the Caps than Hassli has, but that's due only to referees sticking it to Hassli, some dumb moves by Hassli, and Camilo scoring some goals and drawing some fouls

 

[Gloucester_Boy]

Yes, I actually like Harris and agree that he was pretty effective early in the season, especially since the Index is obviously not discounting for shanked chances inside the box. Just pointing out that it's a bit artificial and common sense requires me to question any player rating system that has Blake Wagner listed as more effective than Chuimiento, Koffie, Khalfan, DeMerit (albeit in limited minutes), Teibert, etc.

Agree that the article is a bit over-the-top but I still agree with the point

And amen to your edit. Stats are for people who follow baseball.

 

[Regs]

and to be honest: Camilo HAS been more effective for the Caps than Hassli has, but that's due only to referees sticking it to Hassli, some dumb moves by Hassli, and Camilo scoring some goals and drawing some fouls

More effective?

Both have 3 goals...

Goals/90 minutes:

Camillo 0.41
Hassli 0.57

 

[johnnybluenose]

Regs, I don't mean "effective" as black and white as that.

Clearly Hassli and Rochat, and just behind them- Chiumiento, are the cream of the Whitecaps crop. What I'm inferring (poorly most likely) is that Camilo seems to be able to draw a foul easier than Eric, creating fk chances around the box, is less of a discipline threat for suspensions (diving aside) and has created some different challenges pace and dribbling wise than Hassli does, which is more holding up and such.

clearly Hassli is the better player... he, for me anyways, just hasn't had the same level of offensive effect that Camilo has- yet. I'm sure that will change.

Did I mention stats are for losers?

~Isn'tRegsAStatisticsExpert?