Pay the Players

[GhostRider]

. Fan support is great for those clubs that would draw it in, but the majority of the revenue would need to come from other sources anyhow. Like HOS said: Youth soccer camps, sponsors, and clubhouses.

Dude -
I don't know what the point is of having a club if there isn't a membership/fan support that belong to it. Why would a business sponsor a club that doesn't have any support or in the business' eyes - potential consumers? Why would a club have a clubhouse if there's nobody there to buy the beer? Why would a club take profits from a soccer school and sink it into the men's team that nobody watches?

Furthermore, it's doubtful that somebody with deep pockets will throw money into a team that nobody else cares about.

My point is that fan support is the only way a club should pay for players. The whole point of paying players is to make the team win and who else would care about a winning team than the support?


Here's a simple scenerio that can work:
A club should get at least 500 supporters to every home game. At $5 a head that's $2,500 at the gate. On a crowd of 500 you could make at least $1,000 on beer/concession sales. Average out another $1,000 on sponsorship (billboards, game program, jersey sponsor) per game so you've got $4,500 to pay your staff for 2 games (given that you don't make anything on the away game). So if you pay a roster of 16 between $50-$200 per player your player payroll comes out to about $4,000 for both games which leaves you $500 to pay for a coach which is the key guy. You'll have to generate another $500 per home game to pay for facility/officals/miscellaneous expenses - and that can come from a soccer school or other fund raising activity. Also, on big games with higher attendance you can pay out player performance bonuses. So better players can potentially earn $500/month which is a nice supplement to their full time job.

The biggest barrier to this kind of scenerio is the lack of enclosed fields in the lower mainland that can accomodate 500-2000 spectators comfortably. Swangard is too big, too expensive, and not condusive to soccer spectating, same goes with Town Centre.

I believe any ethnic based team shouldn't have a problem getting 500 people out to their games if they have a moderate amount of promotion and community teams (Burnaby FC, Surrey Utd., etc...) should also be able to get that much. A league with Div 1 and Div 2 (promotion/relegation is essential) with 10 teams in each division is realistic for the lower mainland/fraser valley/island.

I also believe playing in the winter is also the only way to go because people get out of routine in the summer and soccer on Sunday in the winter should be a routine. Also, people are into soccer when the European pro leagues are on.

Another potential source of cash for clubs is the development and export of players but that's another thread.

So again, my point is that the only viable player paying system needs fan support.

 

[Dude]

You took my comment out of context.

The ethnic teams certainly wouldn't have a problem drawing the fans from the community. The other clubs would have to rely on club support. I can tell you with ours, we may or may not get 500 fans out to watch, but the clubhouse itself would be very well used by the members. shite, the Rangers alone (18 players) have been known to make over $1,000.00 on beer sales after Friday evening games (no, I'm not kidding). What I am saying is, the clubs that aren't ethnic based would still be well supported, but there may be games where the only fans attending are the club members. There are also scenarios where the club would host the I-Ties and their fans would outnumber ours 4-1. That's just the reality of the situation. It's OK too...we'd just sell them our beer!

Anyhow, all your ideas are good. I'm just saying that you need to be realistic as well. The restaurant / clubhouse can always be open at other times and used as a revenue generator during non-game times.

 

[GhostRider]

The other clubs would have to rely on club support. I can tell you with ours, we may or may not get 500 fans out to watch, but the clubhouse itself would be very well used by the members.

Dude,
Why would a club take profits from a clubhouse to pay players if nobody comes to the games to watch them win? Does a club without supporters really want to win so much that they're willing to pay players? The scenerio you described is very much what some Rugby clubs are doing now but I doubt (but I could be wrong) they use the cash to pay players.

Also, there's no reason why community based teams can't get out 500 supporters if they do some marketing and just promote themselves as the grassroots team in their community. The problem is there is nowhere to sit these people and no way to collect an admission.

What you're getting at are good ways for clubs to generate revenue but not a good model to pay for players.

 

[Dude]

You are totally missing the point here. This all came up because there is a need to better develop our players. Frankly, most communities don’t see a need to have “Minor League” soccer. You can promote all you want, but you will not draw the fans you envision by trying to run a semi-pro league. The BCJHL example was brought up…most BCJ teams don't draw in the numbers that you are describing, unless it is the only show in town (like Powell River). This is HOCKEY we’re talking about, the sport that is easily the most popular in Canada, BC, and Vancouver. As much as we all love soccer, we need to be realistic- there isn’t a burning desire from the masses to come watch semi pro soccer.

This is why I suggested that this needs to be run as a development program. You are not going to make our National team better by paying 30 year old players $200.00 / month to play. What we need to do is have a strong incentive for young players to treat soccer as a career, and to take it more seriously. The league needs to be targeted towards the best 17-22 year olds, with the incentive that by signing a contract, they get a University Scholarship / Grant in return. The contract could be for a certain number of years, with the stipulation that the players ties himself to the club, with the exception of University play. The system needs to be run as a non-profit society, with paid administrators. By doing this (tying in education with sports development), you will bring yourself MORE sponsors than by trying to sell a semi pro league. You also greatly enhance your chances of Government participation. This way, you ensure the revenues get returned to the game.

You have some good ideas with your model to help generate revenue, but a lot of it is unrealistic. To make this model work, you need involvement from the bigger clubs because you need a feeder system. The harsh reality is that a Metro Ford vs. Surrey United match will not draw 500 fans…especially if the game is played in the winter! By playing the league in the summer, you keep the players playing at a high caliber all year round: University / College in the winter, and the Development league in the summer. They can fill their spare time by playing with their Clubs Premier team during the winter when University isn’t played.

 

[GhostRider]

we'll just have to say we disagree

Dude,
I just can't make the leap to see where you're coming from. I don't think all players care about University Scholarships(or even going to university) and if you believe that we have a public that doesn't care about soccer why do you think there's a business community that does? And you even mention Government assistance? Do you own a TV? BC Junior hockey attendance hovers around the 500 mark and they charge $10/head. But who cares if Trail comes to town anyways?

Ultimately paying players will fall to the responsiblity of clubs and realistically they could only sustain a payroll if there is a support there.

 

[Dude]

Yeah, we will have to disagree. Good for discussion purposes though.

What I’m saying is that it really doesn’t matter what us old farts want anyhow. It should be targeted towards younger players. By tying in the education angle / non-profit angle, business will be willing to “donate to a charity”, instead of buying advertising. Advertising is only a business expense- as far as taxes are concerned- but charitable donations are tax deductible. Businesses get more run for their buck when donating to charity, vs. sponsoring. Sponsoring is considered advertising. A non-profit society would be set up as a charitable sports organization.

In terms of Government participation, I’m not implying direct funding. That’ll never happen. Participation can be in the form of free lease on building, etc (the NAP pavilion is owned by the municipality, not SFC. My understanding is that SFC gets free lease on the Clubhouse). The three levels of Government are not in the business of subsidizing professional sports, but they are in the business of developing amateur athletics. If you show them a workable business plan, that not only benefits the sport, but also ties in education, they three levels are far more likely to participate. Right off the top, you could get involved with HRDC, because it is a unique program. I’m sure there would also be consideration given from the Federal Grant Department if the program is directly tied to education.

Just thinking outside the box, because the “Semi Pro” angle has been done, and continuously fails. You don’t open up a Chinese restaurant on the same corner where one went bankrupt a year ago, do you?

 

[Guinness]

You Don't???

You don’t open up a Chinese restaurant on the same corner where one went bankrupt a year ago, do you?

Dude, I've seen that happen too many times...